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R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: New Schumacher KF2
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Welcome to the KF2 Wiki!

Please feel free to add any Tips, Tricks, or anything that would be beneficial to the KF2 Family

Introduction and Pictures Introduction and Pictures

ElectronicsSetupElectronicsSetups

Setup SheetsSetup Sheets

EmulsionShocksEmulsion Shocks

Tony Newland Gear Diff BuildTony Newland Gear Diff Build

Suggested Gearing

6.5
7.5
8.5
9.5
10.5
13.5
17.5 I ran 69/31 at SRS Scottsdale Arizona and 72/30 at MHOR Aurora Co and Full Throttle ALB, NM RCM lockout worked excellent!


MIP pucks excellent upgrade! The new RCM lockout is an excellent piece as well! These options will greatly reduce weight throughout the drive line!

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Old 08-13-2015, 07:13 AM   #481
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I drove a few laps with a regular shorty too. The only time I really noticed a difference was on a downhill section of the track that goes into a sharp turn. The car felt a little light in the rear.

My car is weighing in at 1633 with the LCG pack that weighs a good 60g less than a regular shorty. I don't know how I'm going to axe ~175g without one for running stock.
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Old 08-13-2015, 07:47 AM   #482
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I got a little time on the track this afternoon to try out the setup Schumacher posted of Orlowski's car. Like I said before, I was surprised by the way they had the front shocks all the way out on the tower, especially after seeing some of the photos of his car at the event where they were not set up this way. I can only conclude that this is where they ended up setup-wise by the end of the event.

I tried to replicate the setup exactly as a starting point but had to drift slightly because I do not have the parts on hand. Here are the exceptions:
  • Slightly heavier oils (450/350 instead of 350/300)
  • Red springs in front instead of white
  • Kit 1.5mm front pistons instead of 1.6mm
  • Kit front arms instead of the medium flex front arms
  • Kit 50.5mm front camber link instead of 42.5mm alloy
  • Cougar KR CVD shafts instead of MIP shiny/pucks
  • No weight under the battery

You guys, the car was DIALED. I could drive the snot out of it all around the track and it was glued. Even in sections of the track that were still slippery from watering I was still hanging on. There was so much forward bite that I was getting tire slap under hard acceleration. I had so much confidence in the car I found myself driving it way too hard and my best times were right there with the B5M even though it felt like I was going way faster. Funny how that happens....

If I had more time I would have transitioned to this setup from what I had bit by bit instead of wholesale so I could learn how what changes had the most impact. But I am pretty sure that the front shocks standing up like that is keeping the weight from transferring, which was making the car so loose off power before.

But for those of you out there who are looking at this MM conversion with a bit of skepticism I think you can safely lay it aside. As suspected, with the main design issue of the motor position solved the car can be tuned to excel on lower grip surfaces. I have attached the setup I used today for those who may be running on similar tracks/surfaces.
Excellent info bro! Checked out your setup did you the outside hole in the yoke?
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Old 08-13-2015, 08:12 AM   #483
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Yes. Outside hole in the front yoke. I'll have that fixed. Thanks for pointing it out.
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Old 08-13-2015, 08:26 AM   #484
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Yes. Outside hole in the front yoke. I'll have that fixed. Thanks for pointing it out.
I thought so! Going to be spending some hard earned cash tomorrow and order some parts. With all this excellent info on the new MM! I can't hold back so I will spend the cash ($700-800) to get what I need and then some. Thank you and everyone else for all the information.😀😁
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Old 08-13-2015, 09:18 AM   #485
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Yeah, I am hoping Schumacher will come up with a way to sell the car in a configuration that is optimized for track surfaces like we run here in the States. Call it the KF2 "Yankee Edition"
  • MM parts
  • MM Shell
  • Ball diff
  • CVDs
  • u4616 aluminum upper trans for rear mounted shocks or a molded piece that permits rear mount
  • Updated manual with base setup similar to what they published for Michal's Euros car

This all comes to about $650 by my calculations using DRC's prices. You end up with an extra shell but otherwise you have a car that can be configured to run extremely well in just about any situation you'll encounter. But most people probably race at one particular place most often and will likely find most of the other parts redundant.

If they could get the MM optimized configuration in the upper 300's just like it is now I think they could start moving a lot of kits here. The B5M Factory Lite @ $279 is a fantastic car right out of the box so the competition is very tough and they will need to have some marketing angle that justifies the extra cost.
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Old 08-13-2015, 12:32 PM   #486
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Originally Posted by motorcitymatt View Post
Yeah, I am hoping Schumacher will come up with a way to sell the car in a configuration that is optimized for track surfaces like we run here in the States. Call it the KF2 "Yankee Edition"
  • MM parts
  • MM Shell
  • Ball diff
  • CVDs
  • u4616 aluminum upper trans for rear mounted shocks or a molded piece that permits rear mount
  • Updated manual with base setup similar to what they published for Michal's Euros car

This all comes to about $650 by my calculations using DRC's prices. You end up with an extra shell but otherwise you have a car that can be configured to run extremely well in just about any situation you'll encounter. But most people probably race at one particular place most often and will likely find most of the other parts redundant.

If they could get the MM optimized configuration in the upper 300's just like it is now I think they could start moving a lot of kits here. The B5M Factory Lite @ $279 is a fantastic car right out of the box so the competition is very tough and they will need to have some marketing angle that justifies the extra cost.
I agree 😁
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Old 08-13-2015, 04:52 PM   #487
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I agree 😁
Matt going to use your setup as my base setup! 😀 I will drop the ride height -1 F/R due to the small jumps on my track and the tons of grip we have. Do you have any other suggestions!
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:32 PM   #488
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Im running mine right now at our track. The track conditions are about as loose as can be and im really impressed with the car. I flipped the arms and it made a huge difference. Its really good other than being loose getting on the straight, but my b5m is loose there aswell. Usually on club nights it grooves up and there is tons of grip.
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Old 08-13-2015, 06:36 PM   #489
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I flipped the arms and it made a huge difference.
I am assuming you meant the rear arms? Did you start off with the front arms flipped too?

Also, are you running the 4 degree rear toe-in blocks? The kit ones are just 3 degrees.
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Old 08-13-2015, 08:07 PM   #490
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Yeah just flipped the rear arms only and running 3 deg rear toe. Car weighs 1597g, im running mod so im not too concerned about weight. I have a promatch 3500 battery and 30g on each side of the rear of the car. I was very happy with how it was handling tonight, much more consistent than my b5m.
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Old 08-14-2015, 08:14 PM   #491
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Originally Posted by MelKF2 View Post
Matt going to use your setup as my base setup! 😀 I will drop the ride height -1 F/R due to the small jumps on my track and the tons of grip we have. Do you have any other suggestions!
One thing I can think of is if you are going to race stock (or just want to remove a lot of slop from the drivetrain) you may want to invest in the MIP puck drive conversion. Had I known about it I would have probably used it instead of the Cougar KR CVDs. The MIP shafts will sit a little deeper in the cups if you want to run more shock travel without worrying about the shafts popping out. I am not sure of the exact amount of weight savings but just the fact they are using aluminum diff outdrives instead of the very bulky steel ones has to be good for at least 10 grams. Maybe someone else who has used them can comment on that?

So instead of buying an assembled ball diff and the Cougar KR CVDs you would just need to buy the diff pulley and fences (U4196), some carbide balls (U2459) and some diff rings (U3140). The MIP kit has the rest. It ends up working out to be about 23 dollars more than buying a fully assembled ball diff plus the KR shafts. I don't think DiscountRC carries MIP stuff but Phil please correct me if I am wrong.

The only other thing I can say at the moment is to be patient if the car isn't great right off the bat in the conditions on which you are running it. This car really wasn't originally designed for the kinds of surfaces we run on in the States with the exception of some indoor carpet racing and some super high bite clay and sugared tracks. But now with the preliminary results being very positive with the MM conversion (with the right setup) and the fact that Schumacher put two cars with the kit in the A main at the Euros on dirt I feel more confident all the time that we can tune this car to pretty much any situation we encounter.

And with events like this popping up in the USA we know we have something that can really compete as higher grip surfaces become more common:

http://blog.jconcepts.net/2015/08/jc...urf-nationals/
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Old 08-14-2015, 09:13 PM   #492
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Originally Posted by motorcitymatt View Post
One thing I can think of is if you are going to race stock (or just want to remove a lot of slop from the drivetrain) you may want to invest in the MIP puck drive conversion. Had I known about it I would have probably used it instead of the Cougar KR CVDs. The MIP shafts will sit a little deeper in the cups if you want to run more shock travel without worrying about the shafts popping out. I am not sure of the exact amount of weight savings but just the fact they are using aluminum diff outdrives instead of the very bulky steel ones has to be good for at least 10 grams. Maybe someone else who has used them can comment on that?

So instead of buying an assembled ball diff and the Cougar KR CVDs you would just need to buy the diff pulley and fences (U4196), some carbide balls (U2459) and some diff rings (U3140). The MIP kit has the rest. It ends up working out to be about 23 dollars more than buying a fully assembled ball diff plus the KR shafts. I don't think DiscountRC carries MIP stuff but Phil please correct me if I am wrong.

The only other thing I can say at the moment is to be patient if the car isn't great right off the bat in the conditions on which you are running it. This car really wasn't originally designed for the kinds of surfaces we run on in the States with the exception of some indoor carpet racing and some super high bite clay and sugared tracks. But now with the preliminary results being very positive with the MM conversion (with the right setup) and the fact that Schumacher put two cars with the kit in the A main at the Euros on dirt I feel more confident all the time that we can tune this car to pretty much any situation we encounter.

And with events like this popping up in the USA we know we have something that can really compete as higher grip surfaces become more common:

http://blog.jconcepts.net/2015/08/jc...urf-nationals/
Thanks Matt I ordered the MIP Pucks this morning and the rest of the parts needed! I should be on the track (MHOR R/C) Aurora, Co next week to let the Cougar out of her cage! ☺ Thanks again for all your help.
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Old 08-15-2015, 05:43 AM   #493
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Thanks! Im going to be running an lrp flow and as it sits i cant fit it behind the motor but just barely. If it were a tiny bit smaller it would fit though. With a little trimming i might be able to get it to fit. Im going to run it up front for now. Im making some tungsten nuts at work today to add weight to the rear corners if needed. They will just screw into the rear sidepod holes. I might get creative later on and try to get the esc behind the motor.
I think the novak impact would fit...
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Old 08-15-2015, 12:03 PM   #494
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Here is a quick way for those running stock to drop a quick 18g from the car, and all of it rotating mass to boot. You can also completely eliminate the slipper with this if you tighten the adjusting nut enough. I prefer to keep it loose enough to allow something to take up some shock on the drivetrain when landing jumps in case you happen to be on the gas.

See the attached photos. Basically, you just pull off the cage holding the slipper plates and put one of the friction discs aside. Then just keep one bearing in the spur gear and place the shim on too. Put the disc you saved into the spur gear and then put the top plate back on. I am using a spring from the B5M and it is large enough to allow the full range of adjustment along the stock layshaft. It is Associated part #9739

http://www.teamassociated.com/parts/details/9739/

The stock centering collar that goes on top of the spring fits nicely so the spring is the only part you need. I have seen others take slightly different approaches to slimming down or eliminating the slipper on our car but this seems like the best way so far IMO.
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New Schumacher KF2-img_0444.jpg   New Schumacher KF2-img_0445.jpg  
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Old 08-15-2015, 05:15 PM   #495
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Here is a quick way for those running stock to drop a quick 18g from the car, and all of it rotating mass to boot. You can also completely eliminate the slipper with this if you tighten the adjusting nut enough. I prefer to keep it loose enough to allow something to take up some shock on the drivetrain when landing jumps in case you happen to be on the gas.

See the attached photos. Basically, you just pull off the cage holding the slipper plates and put one of the friction discs aside. Then just keep one bearing in the spur gear and place the shim on too. Put the disc you saved into the spur gear and then put the top plate back on. I am using a spring from the B5M and it is large enough to allow the full range of adjustment along the stock layshaft. It is Associated part #9739

http://www.teamassociated.com/parts/details/9739/

The stock centering collar that goes on top of the spring fits nicely so the spring is the only part you need. I have seen others take slightly different approaches to slimming down or eliminating the slipper on our car but this seems like the best way so far IMO.
Matt you must be psychics! I order asc 9739 yesterday. My cage parts weight at 17.9grs (SkyRC).
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