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Old 10-07-2014, 09:04 AM   #8326
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Yeah, that's exactly the responses I have found as well, just never an actual explanation as to "why" the front would be more consistent (I would be interested in hearing the physics behind that theory) as well as moving the rear tires forward would help minimally (given that there are way more effective ways to balance for traction) and doesn't make sense due to the fact a slightly longer wheelbase helps the stability on the straights. If I could find drivers who could attest that it no doubt improved the drive-ability of the car, I would be willing to give it a shot, however it looks to me like some Factory drivers bolted the parts on, and instantly Associated sold thousands of sets of arms and front towers that they normally would not have sold. They intelligently found another market for those items.
It is a tuning option. I see guys running the gulwings and loving them. I didnt. I like a more forgiving and easy car to drive. I feel like the RM parts did that for the car.
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Old 10-07-2014, 09:12 AM   #8327
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So I just completed my build and installed the RM front arms with the MM front tower and mounted the shocks to the inner most hole which looks to be the same as the center hole of the RM. I have RM rear arms coming to test as well.
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Old 10-07-2014, 09:13 AM   #8328
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The Factory AE guys at Tacoma (and myself) are now running the Carbon/Hard straight front arms, with the stock gullwing tower, and reducing the stroke of the front shocks to 18mm with an additional 2mm internal limiter.

We run on a VERY high bite indoor clay track and this setup made a pretty dramatic difference in how smooth and predictable the buggy steers in the high speed sections of the track. We ran the gold cup this weekend, and in the high speed sections of the track, as the traction came up, the stock setup cars were a little edgy and unpredictable. Moving to this setup in the middle of the 3 day race made a very noticeable difference in how the car drove for me. It feels like it may have removed steering a little bit from the high speed sections of the track, and added it to the lower speed sections of the track... it's a bit hard to tell exactly what is happening, but the car was certainly easier and more predictable, which allowed me to push the car a little harder.
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Old 10-07-2014, 09:15 AM   #8329
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I know this isn't necessary the correct place for this ,but will the B5 shock caps work on my t4.2. One of the bleeder screws is stuck in the aluminum cap and only way to get it out is to drill it which is nearly impossible.
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Old 10-07-2014, 09:21 AM   #8330
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
The Factory AE guys at Tacoma (and myself) are now running the Carbon/Hard straight front arms, with the stock gullwing tower, and reducing the stroke of the front shocks to 18mm with an additional 2mm internal limiter.

We run on a VERY high bite indoor clay track and this setup made a pretty dramatic difference in how smooth and predictable the buggy steers in the high speed sections of the track. We ran the gold cup this weekend, and in the high speed sections of the track, as the traction came up, the stock setup cars were a little edgy and unpredictable. Moving to this setup in the middle of the 3 day race made a very noticeable difference in how the car drove for me. It feels like it may have removed steering a little bit from the high speed sections of the track, and added it to the lower speed sections of the track... it's a bit hard to tell exactly what is happening, but the car was certainly easier and more predictable, which allowed me to push the car a little harder.
This is great information for me. What hole did they mount to on the tower? The inside, middle or outside.

Looks like I need to add some limiters to my shocks. It would be great to get a quick complete front shock set-up if you have it.

Thanks!
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Old 10-07-2014, 01:39 PM   #8331
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Tried the Inline set up this weekend at Tacoma for the gold cup. Saw lots of people doing it so I had to. Car was much much better. A lot more consistent. Rotated really good and was really stable! We will see how it does at my local carpet track.
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Old 10-07-2014, 02:57 PM   #8332
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What are the shock limiters doing to the way the buggy handles?
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Old 10-07-2014, 05:18 PM   #8333
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What are the shock limiters doing to the way the buggy handles?
When used inside the shock body it reduces roll obviously when cornering but when accelerating it adds rear traction when done correctly. Essentially changing the droop of the shock.
Less droop in the front will usually give more on power steering, more droop willincrease off power steering.
Less droop in the rear will increase stability in high speed turns and increasing it will add more off power steering and also reduce a little high speed stability.
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Old 10-07-2014, 05:23 PM   #8334
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Originally Posted by Jcozz View Post
Tried the Inline set up this weekend at Tacoma for the gold cup. Saw lots of people doing it so I had to. Car was much much better. A lot more consistent. Rotated really good and was really stable! We will see how it does at my local carpet track.
Can you post a pic ...thinking of doing this to my car.
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Old 10-07-2014, 10:48 PM   #8335
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Originally Posted by TomErickson View Post
This is great information for me. What hole did they mount to on the tower? The inside, middle or outside.
This is a tiny adjustment to the overall leverage the arm has against the shock. Just start in the middle.

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Originally Posted by TomErickson View Post
Looks like I need to add some limiters to my shocks. It would be great to get a quick complete front shock set-up if you have it.
Here is what I ran in 17.5 this last weekend at the gold cup

Front Shock:
Carbon Flat RM arms
Stock MM tower
Middle hole tower mount
Outer hole arm mount
White Spring
Stock Piston
37.5 Oil
4mm Shock limiters (this is because I am running the MM tower, which would create too much droop without the extra limiters. the stroke listed below is key)
18mm stroke
23.5mm ride height

Rear
Stock everything, tower/arms/piston with 32.5 oil
Middle hole tower mount
Inner hole arm mount
~26mm stroke (taken from Luke Smith's setup.. i don't recall mine off hand)
23mm ride height
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Last edited by Cpt.America; 10-08-2014 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 10-08-2014, 11:31 AM   #8336
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Originally Posted by Skeeter36 View Post
When used inside the shock body it reduces roll obviously when cornering but when accelerating it adds rear traction when done correctly. Essentially changing the droop of the shock.
Less droop in the front will usually give more on power steering, more droop willincrease off power steering.
Less droop in the rear will increase stability in high speed turns and increasing it will add more off power steering and also reduce a little high speed stability.
can you explain shock droop and what it looks like. Sorry for newbie questions.
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Old 10-08-2014, 11:42 AM   #8337
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Hi everyone. Anyone have any insight or some information for running a shorty in the B5M? I know Wild Cherry had an inline setup, but I was wondering if anyone was running the more traditional way. (Sideways) Forward or back, etc. I have even seen some with the ESC between the battery and the motor. Let me know! Thanks.

BTW running outdoors in south Florida, clay track, medium to high bite.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:06 PM   #8338
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can you explain shock droop and what it looks like. Sorry for newbie questions.
"Shock Droop" isn't a very good term to use, and can be confusing. There are two related things/terms to understand:

1: Droop
2: Shock Stroke

1- "Droop" is the distance the chassis travels between static ride height, and the point where the wheels come off the ground. (chassis lift or chassis rise)

2- "Shock Stroke" is the length of the shock shaft showing when it is fully extended.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:10 PM   #8339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHKracing View Post
Hi everyone. Anyone have any insight or some information for running a shorty in the B5M? I know Wild Cherry had an inline setup, but I was wondering if anyone was running the more traditional way. (Sideways) Forward or back, etc. I have even seen some with the ESC between the battery and the motor. Let me know! Thanks.

BTW running outdoors in south Florida, clay track, medium to high bite.
Guys that are running an "inline" setup, are referring to the ESC, and shorty battery, being run down the middle of the car. Drivers will cut out the inner webbing of the rear waterfall AND the chassis pod, so they can literally tuck their ESC inside the waterfall almost up against the motor. Then the shorty battery sits directly in front of the ESC lengthwise.

If you are looking for slightly more rear-tire weight bias, you can run your setup like I do... which is the shorty run horizontally in the back up against the waterfall, and then the ESC dead center right up against the battery. This requires you cut away the section of the chassis pod in-between the battery posts.

If you want a little more weight forward, you can run the battery horizontal against the waterfall, and then run your esc and reciever forward of the battery posts. Or you can even run the battery slightly more forward.

Static weight bias balance is a great tuning aid.
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Last edited by Cpt.America; 10-08-2014 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:38 PM   #8340
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The first page of this thread has several pics of an "inline setup" if you want to see different ways to accomplish it.
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