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Uneven tire wear front vs back?
#1
Uneven tire wear front vs back?
hello guys,
never had this issue before, but I am curious why this happening and what effect it has on handling as my car steers well.
the front tires are completely worn, while the rears ( 4wd 1/10 buggy running on hard clay) still have half tread left.
i assume this isn’t normal and the front is pulling the rear around the the track? If this is so, could that explain issues clearing a double jump no one else has issues with?
i have addressed all the other issues with setup and still can barely clear and that is only if I square up around the corner and hit it perfectly.. I have only about 8 feet before the jump to clear it and get up to speed and I geared down which was slightly beneficial but not enough
the jump is the main issue and I am wondering if there is a connection, assuming I am not getting balanced grip from to back? And need to increase the rear gripin order for the ass end to launch?
any advice would be great.
kit and pro setups all specify 10000 fluid equal weighting front and rear, etc I say that because a local guy said the front was “ diffing out” .. not too sure what that means if true.
any advice would be great
never had this issue before, but I am curious why this happening and what effect it has on handling as my car steers well.
the front tires are completely worn, while the rears ( 4wd 1/10 buggy running on hard clay) still have half tread left.
i assume this isn’t normal and the front is pulling the rear around the the track? If this is so, could that explain issues clearing a double jump no one else has issues with?
i have addressed all the other issues with setup and still can barely clear and that is only if I square up around the corner and hit it perfectly.. I have only about 8 feet before the jump to clear it and get up to speed and I geared down which was slightly beneficial but not enough
the jump is the main issue and I am wondering if there is a connection, assuming I am not getting balanced grip from to back? And need to increase the rear gripin order for the ass end to launch?
any advice would be great.
kit and pro setups all specify 10000 fluid equal weighting front and rear, etc I say that because a local guy said the front was “ diffing out” .. not too sure what that means if true.
any advice would be great
#2
Tech Addict
4wd buggys will wear down front tires a little faster. Something like 3 front tire sets for every 2 sets of rear tires in my experience. If you're having trouble getting pop off a jump, try to stiffen up the back just slightly. You can try adding a small amount of antisquat, or one stiffer rear spring, or standing up the rear shocks. Diff oils do leak out or get worn out so depending on how long it's been since you last filled them, it could be time to refresh them.
#3
Tech Initiate
If yours is one of those belt driven car, use the front clicker instead. Act’s like a 2wd when off power during cornering. Much less wear on the fronts. Same result as using a front one way diff. If you are a “late hard braking into the corner” kind of guy, not recommended though...
#4
Tech Master
if all 4 tires are the same... you should be rotating them regularly .
also while you were adjusting for a better setup.. you could have started an uneven wear pattern on the fronts.. and now you see the end result.
also, the rears only drive forward... but the fronts drive and steer.. more wear... just like Real 4x4 trucks.
also while you were adjusting for a better setup.. you could have started an uneven wear pattern on the fronts.. and now you see the end result.
also, the rears only drive forward... but the fronts drive and steer.. more wear... just like Real 4x4 trucks.
#5
Balance is off, the car may feel like its steering well but if the fronts are wearing that fast then to me its pushing.
I would second the motion to try and stiffen the rear up a little to help with the jump. In return that could also help keep the weight on the front and not feel a loss in steering.
Actually it would give you more and let you turn the wheel less thus scrub the fronts across the track surface.
More bite to the rear for traction and wear with less wear on the front, maybe balance it out better.
I would second the motion to try and stiffen the rear up a little to help with the jump. In return that could also help keep the weight on the front and not feel a loss in steering.
Actually it would give you more and let you turn the wheel less thus scrub the fronts across the track surface.
More bite to the rear for traction and wear with less wear on the front, maybe balance it out better.
#6
Tech Champion
iTrader: (33)
I currently race on turf with my 1/10 buggy and I get a fairly balanced wear between front/rear. I believe this is because I'm running 15-60-7. Because of the high traction surface I can go up to a thicker center diff so the front doesn't unload on hard acceleration.
With my 1/8 Truggy I'm running 15-20-10 on dirt, this lets the front wheels unload more so the front of the truck pulls more through the corners. There is a trade off, if you go too thick on the center diff for too loose of a surface then the car will tend to get twitchy, sometimes having lower center diff can make the car easier to drive at the expense of faster front tire wear:
With my 1/8 Truggy I'm running 15-20-10 on dirt, this lets the front wheels unload more so the front of the truck pulls more through the corners. There is a trade off, if you go too thick on the center diff for too loose of a surface then the car will tend to get twitchy, sometimes having lower center diff can make the car easier to drive at the expense of faster front tire wear:
#7
Dumb question, is the circumference of your front tires equal to the circumference of your rear tires?
#8
First of all, thank you all for the responses. I will go down and answer/comment on a few rather than individual replies. (Along the way I will explain my logic which is probably faulty so it can be corrected. )
trf211 - Wouldnt standing up the shocks soften the suspension? most of the guides say that, and I am already running the stiffest spring. Or are you staying mounting them more vertical will produce more of a rear pop off the jump? Also, i gather thinner oils cause more wear due to rotating harder through corners? (Note: the fronts are bald on the top, not the sides if that changes things.)
yanspe76 - yeah its a schumacher L1. I will experiment with that. But yeah, I like to drive more aggressive, and it handles better with the FAB (front adjustable break) tightened down for just a little free forward movement.
Robbob- from my understanding, stiffening up the rear will give LESS traction wear on the rear tires due to not allowing the car to absorb into the ground during acceleration, and therefore more traction on the front? I agree that results in more steering, but i am a bit confused.
BigChrisPA - yeah, same proline tires all around. (I think I got medium grip, so perhaps I should have gotten soft. (I am thinking about the jump here.))
Billdelong- yeaqh I dont have a center diff. And I did have a leaky front diff, but rebuilt it and thought I fixed that as I dont see collection of dirt on the outer exposed bearings or oil along the belt to the extent I did before. I purchased a diff rebuild kit to have on hand, and I did notice even though they both apparently arent leaking, then spin much more freely than when I rebuilt them.
*** As a side note, I bought a motor analyzer to delve into adjusting timing which is new for me. From research on the forums, opinion seems mixed. I know higher timing = less acceleration which I need for the jump, and it is both an art and a science to find the sweet spot. I know its a combo of gearing and timing, and I shouldnt go over 150 temps, but is the ideal amp draw?
Currently, I am 140 temps, 3.0 amps. Should I drop the pinion down and up the timing and amp draw until I hit 150?
trf211 - Wouldnt standing up the shocks soften the suspension? most of the guides say that, and I am already running the stiffest spring. Or are you staying mounting them more vertical will produce more of a rear pop off the jump? Also, i gather thinner oils cause more wear due to rotating harder through corners? (Note: the fronts are bald on the top, not the sides if that changes things.)
yanspe76 - yeah its a schumacher L1. I will experiment with that. But yeah, I like to drive more aggressive, and it handles better with the FAB (front adjustable break) tightened down for just a little free forward movement.
Robbob- from my understanding, stiffening up the rear will give LESS traction wear on the rear tires due to not allowing the car to absorb into the ground during acceleration, and therefore more traction on the front? I agree that results in more steering, but i am a bit confused.
BigChrisPA - yeah, same proline tires all around. (I think I got medium grip, so perhaps I should have gotten soft. (I am thinking about the jump here.))
Billdelong- yeaqh I dont have a center diff. And I did have a leaky front diff, but rebuilt it and thought I fixed that as I dont see collection of dirt on the outer exposed bearings or oil along the belt to the extent I did before. I purchased a diff rebuild kit to have on hand, and I did notice even though they both apparently arent leaking, then spin much more freely than when I rebuilt them.
*** As a side note, I bought a motor analyzer to delve into adjusting timing which is new for me. From research on the forums, opinion seems mixed. I know higher timing = less acceleration which I need for the jump, and it is both an art and a science to find the sweet spot. I know its a combo of gearing and timing, and I shouldnt go over 150 temps, but is the ideal amp draw?
Currently, I am 140 temps, 3.0 amps. Should I drop the pinion down and up the timing and amp draw until I hit 150?
#9
Tech Champion
iTrader: (33)
Since you have a center slipper, it sounds like it might be adjusted too soft, I would tighten it down a pinch and see how your wear goes then... just be careful not to lock the center slipper unless you're on high traction running 13.5T. I ran a slipper eliminator on my K2 when I used to run Schumacher. Even on medium traction clay I would get even wear on front/rear.
#10
Robbob- from my understanding, stiffening up the rear will give LESS traction wear on the rear tires due to not allowing the car to absorb into the ground during acceleration, and therefore more traction on the front? I agree that results in more steering, but i am a bit confused.
I was told it this way ..... is the soft suspension letting the car absord the ground or is a stiff suspension pushing the tires down into the ground?
The more I throught about it I could see it. I had a situation where I had too much forward bite creating a push.
Veteran racer told me add a little squat into the car. I said wont that let the rear gain traction? He said nope, it takes the pressure off the rear wheels, less traction.
I ws schooled and always think about his adjustment when it comes to rear bite.
#11
Since you have a center slipper, it sounds like it might be adjusted too soft, I would tighten it down a pinch and see how your wear goes then... just be careful not to lock the center slipper unless you're on high traction running 13.5T. I ran a slipper eliminator on my K2 when I used to run Schumacher. Even on medium traction clay I would get even wear on front/rear.
(it was offered as an option part for K1/K2 and previous models, but comes stock with the L1)
Last edited by mdl060374; 11-06-2018 at 02:00 PM.
#12
I thought the same but have noticed different and granted there is a balance point of too stiff.
I was told it this way ..... is the soft suspension letting the car absord the ground or is a stiff suspension pushing the tires down into the ground?
The more I throught about it I could see it. I had a situation where I had too much forward bite creating a push.
Veteran racer told me add a little squat into the car. I said wont that let the rear gain traction? He said nope, it takes the pressure off the rear wheels, less traction.
I ws schooled and always think about his adjustment when it comes to rear bite.
I was told it this way ..... is the soft suspension letting the car absord the ground or is a stiff suspension pushing the tires down into the ground?
The more I throught about it I could see it. I had a situation where I had too much forward bite creating a push.
Veteran racer told me add a little squat into the car. I said wont that let the rear gain traction? He said nope, it takes the pressure off the rear wheels, less traction.
I ws schooled and always think about his adjustment when it comes to rear bite.
Last edited by mdl060374; 11-06-2018 at 01:59 PM.
#13
Tech Addict
In my experience standing up the rear shocks on the tower make the suspension stiffer sprung. Imagine a nutcracker, one lever is the suspension arm and the other lever is the shock tower. The further you move the nut(shock) from the center, the harder it is to crack/compress. So moving the shock out on the tower will result in a stiffer spring suspension, allowing it to square up a little better leaving a corner and will give more support on the face of a jump.
Anti squat will resist the rearward weight shift during throttle and cause additional pressure on the rear tires during acceleration, keeping a flatter chassis. In my experience this will give more pop and drive off the lip of a jump, make the back push a little on throttle and have more steering off throttle. I don't like a lot of antisquat however it will help with clearing jumps.
From reading it over it sounds like you could up the front diff oil one step. Shortening the rear camber link is a good way to give more rear support leaving a corner as well.
Anti squat will resist the rearward weight shift during throttle and cause additional pressure on the rear tires during acceleration, keeping a flatter chassis. In my experience this will give more pop and drive off the lip of a jump, make the back push a little on throttle and have more steering off throttle. I don't like a lot of antisquat however it will help with clearing jumps.
From reading it over it sounds like you could up the front diff oil one step. Shortening the rear camber link is a good way to give more rear support leaving a corner as well.
Last edited by trf211; 11-06-2018 at 06:53 PM.