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R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Official Team Associated RC10 B5m Mid-Motor Thread
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Old 02-25-2016, 03:25 AM   #18526
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Originally Posted by Toyman_R View Post
is there a difference in handling between 25 degrees bulkhead+5 caster block insert and 30 degrees bulkhead and 0 caster block?
Overall angle is the same.
Well, in theory 30 at the bulkhead should result in more weightshift f/r during acceleration/braking than 25 since the arms are more inclined... But feel free to correct me, if I'm wrong.
Just another armchair engineer...
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Old 02-25-2016, 04:16 AM   #18527
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Well, in theory 30 at the bulkhead should result in more weightshift f/r during acceleration/braking than 25 since the arms are more inclined... But feel free to correct me, if I'm wrong.
Just another armchair engineer...
yes, that's correct + (based on quick googling) kick-up also affects jumping.
More angled springs (eg 30 degrees) "shoot" the car higher
It seems, AE's decision to separate kick-up and caster adjustments was pretty smart
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Old 02-25-2016, 04:26 AM   #18528
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thank you
it really helps

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Old 02-25-2016, 07:13 AM   #18529
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I broke the 25 degree after making like 2 laps with my new car... there was a guy at the track that must have been an associated guy because he gave me a new part and didn't want any $ for it... then I broke it in like 2 laps lol. (There were some newbies on the track causing mayhem and I shouldn't have even been running the car with them.) So I had to run the 30 for the rest of the day. I didn't notice a bit of difference. Put an aluminum 25 in... no difference that I could recognize there either.
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Old 02-26-2016, 06:38 AM   #18530
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There is a substantial difference in the feel between 25 and 30...to racers that have been racing a while. That feel is what you are looking for at this time in your racing career. Getting enough wheel time with the car to be able to feel changes. Not that I can drive for a hill of crap, but I can feel the difference in about 1/2 front camber increments. Keep driving, the more the better!!
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Old 02-26-2016, 08:56 AM   #18531
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BRSracing....We can only hope!
B6
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Old 02-26-2016, 05:11 PM   #18532
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B6
Dang right to the B6. No B5.1, I like your style!
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Old 02-27-2016, 08:23 AM   #18533
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Dang right to the B6. No B5.1, I like your style!
It took 10 years to get from the B4 to the B5 - and you guys think a B6 will come within 2 of the B5?

I'll assume none of you guys work in product production, but producing molded plastic isn't cheap, at all. The molds themselves are custom one-off CNC machined. They are VERY expensive, and it takes some time to get your money back on them before you make a large redesign.

Sure, I bet you'd see a ".1" series within the next year or two, but it's hardly going to be earth shattering. The next year will be filled with special edition models to help sales flood the market and recover costs plus profits on the current design. I'd even bet there's a legit "factory team" model at some point, but don't hold your breath waiting.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:04 AM   #18534
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It took 10 years to get from the B4 to the B5 - and you guys think a B6 will come within 2 of the B5?

I'll assume none of you guys work in product production, but producing molded plastic isn't cheap, at all. The molds themselves are custom one-off CNC machined. They are VERY expensive, and it takes some time to get your money back on them before you make a large redesign.

Sure, I bet you'd see a ".1" series within the next year or two, but it's hardly going to be earth shattering. The next year will be filled with special edition models to help sales flood the market and recover costs plus profits on the current design. I'd even bet theirs a legit "factory team" model at some point, but don't hold your breath waiting.
The market and the rc scene has changed too much since the ten year old B4 platform. Today AE is competing with more than just a couple other companies. Not saying i am 100% on but from what i am seeing and hearing i feel pretty confident something new is in the works.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:05 AM   #18535
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The market and the rc scene has changed too much since the ten year old B4 platform. Today AE is competing with more than just a couple other companies. Not saying i am 100% on but from what i am seeing and hearing i feel pretty confident something new is in the works.
What is there left to prove? This stuff is like computers - the wheel never stops turning for development. However, it's also about profits and winning.

They won the worlds against all of the publicly available specialty cars. Kody is a DAMN sharp engineer for 1/10th scale, and that laydown car was spectacular.

Basic business 101 says that you want to turn a profit before you spend tons of cash to build a new model. AE is not being beat at a high level because of the car - the factory won't let that happen. That doesn't mean turning out new publicly available cars, it means turning out custom needed parts to make sure they win. CNCing a few delrin parts for your factory drivers is cheap compared to making molds and making it publicly available.

The b5m is not being beat because it's an inferior car. They get beat by better drivers and cars on par with them.

Yokomo, Losi, Xray, HB etc can turn out a new car every month - they won't beat AE because their car is better, they can win if their car is on par AND their drivers are better.

This hobby is STILL 90% driver, and 10% car. Hell, we saw what many called an inferior car the 22 2.0 was win SEVERAL times because their top drivers are DAMN fast.

For some reason though, at the lower level that you and I are at, racers are convinced the car somehow holds them back, and we need the newest and greatest car and parts to win. It's consumerism being 100% effective in the market.

AE is doing it right - new car when it's absolutely needed (switch to mid motor..) and then refining from there. I think they're doing is better also because they recognized the HUGE 17.5 market in the USA, and turned out the Lite car.

Look at brands like Xray - smart guys, but completely missed the ball on a capable car for 17.5 market. (no smaller spur gears..). Look at yokomo - they've actually gone backwards in a sorts. Dropped a new car with the motor very far forward, only to develop a 3 gear a full year AFTER AE made one for their drivers on dirt surfaces.

Bottomline - is there a specific need for a "b6"? Sure, there always will be when the next generation of refined mid motor cars make the B5m behind - but that time isn't now.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:26 AM   #18536
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what is everyones thought on a laydwon/LCG transmission? Ive almost got enough spare parts to build a laydown transmission car or i can just rebuild the car i have now. seems like there area few companies making the parts for the conversion and they look very nice.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:36 AM   #18537
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You post highlights what I am saying:
1: the car they won with at the worlds is not available to the public
2: the only car they make right now is the lite car, which when it was released was advertised as being best for stock racing (so no car for mod?) The lite chassis does not work well at all in mod and no mod drivers use it around here.
3: several tracks are switching to carpet and the B5 is not designed for carpet, or they would have used it at the worlds as is.
4: Consumers will not spend 300 on a car and then another 100-200 to make it work for their needs such as carpet.
5: Xray and Durango have carpet and dirt cars because that is the direction the industry is headed.
Team associated realized how far behind they were at the worlds last year. The B44 could not compete in the hands of the worlds best drivers and the B5 was far from a B5 that the public can buy. So actually they are behind schedule if you ask me. Like it or not carpet racing is here to stay and more tracks will convert as its popularity grows. I have never been fond of carpet but it is what it is. Rear motor is dead and the need for a rear motor and mid motor car is in the past. The now is a carpet and dirt car. Time will tell either way makes for good conversation.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:37 AM   #18538
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what is everyones thought on a laydwon/LCG transmission? Ive almost got enough spare parts to build a laydown transmission car or i can just rebuild the car i have now. seems like there area few companies making the parts for the conversion and they look very nice.
Basic physics.

More corner speed as the expense of forward bite. However, there are more parts to the equation that need to be answered before a true response could be made.

What surface are you on?

How far off the lead guys are you? 1/10ths of a second, or several seconds a lap?

How good is your throttle control?

What class are you racing?

What weight and balance are you at now?

Are you saucing, and how much grip does the car have after a 5 minute run when the sauce is gone and the tire is hot?
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:42 AM   #18539
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Originally Posted by BRSracing View Post
You post highlights what I am saying:
1: the car they won with at the worlds is not available to the public
2: the only car they make right now is the lite car, which when it was released was advertised as being best for stock racing (so no car for mod?) The lite chassis does not work well at all in mod and no mod drivers use it around here.
1. - so what?

2. That's subjective. I loved the lite chassis in mod.

Quote:
3: several tracks are switching to carpet and the B5 is not designed for carpet, or they would have used it at the worlds as is.
4: Consumers will not spend 300 on a car and then another 100-200 to make it work for their needs such as carpet.
3. Cite please - currently in the USA, majority tracks are still dirt
4. Yes they will - look at all the laydown trannies out - they sell because there is a need

Quote:
5: Xray and Durango have carpet and dirt cars because that is the direction the industry is headed.
If this were true, Losi would have rolled a carpet car when the 3.0 came out. They saw the risk vs reward as did AE, and ignored the small carpet market.

Quote:
Team associated realized how far behind they were at the worlds last year. The B44 could not compete in the hands of the worlds best drivers
We're talking about 2wd cars, not a 15 year old 4wd design

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and the B5 was far from a B5 that the public can buy. So actually they are behind schedule if you ask me. Like it or not carpet racing is here to stay and more tracks will convert as its popularity grows. I have never been fond of carpet but it is what it is. Rear motor is dead and the need for a rear motor and mid motor car is in the past. The now is a carpet and dirt car. Time will tell either way makes for good conversation.
All subjective. Who cares if they run a prototype car? Their original stealth 1990 car masami dominated with never came to market.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:42 AM   #18540
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Im on a clay surface that has very good grip. i run mod class and id say im around back of the A guy. I just use liquid wrench for sauce and i think my car gets better as the run goes on.


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Basic physics.

More corner speed as the expense of forward bite. However, there are more parts to the equation that need to be answered before a true response could be made.

What surface are you on?

How far off the lead guys are you? 1/10ths of a second, or several seconds a lap?

How good is your throttle control?

What class are you racing?

What weight and balance are you at now?

Are you saucing, and how much grip does the car have after a 5 minute run when the sauce is gone and the tire is hot?
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