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Old 08-25-2015, 05:19 AM   #15271
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Serious now.....back to the B5M discussion. This is the B5M thread.
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Old 08-25-2015, 07:21 AM   #15272
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To help things get back on topic, I remember a while back people asking about the quality of the AC RC gear lowrider off of shapeways compared to the reds workshop. So, I have been running the AC RC one, with a slipper eliminator, and have yet to strip any gears. Gear mesh seems a little tight internally, and the reds has less internal resistance. But for the difference in price... I can live with that. Also note that the AC RC uses the old style top shaft and bearings. And if you want to save some extra coin on your low rider conversion, its pretty easy to replace the waterfall and battery strap with a carbon B5R strap and a turnbuckle to the gearbox, using shock eyelets on the turnbuckle. But the main question was, is it reliable? Yes
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Old 08-25-2015, 10:10 AM   #15273
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Originally Posted by mgers75 View Post
Nope no problems driving semi-fast and consistent. Ive seen that video of Wildcat driving at SRS and I'm pretty sure i'd lap him twice in a 6 min main haha (jk wildcat).......Perhaps the problem is I've never really tried changing pistons at track to do back-to-back comparisons because I hate messing with those e-clips and having to take the shock eyelet off to get to the piston and reseting the shock lengths. Would be a good reason to get the new shock shafts perhaps.

But what exactly do people like better about the 3 x 1.4 pistons. Do they have more pack and jump better but with the smaller holes still give the traction of a bigger piston? Sorry if i sound like an imbecile, but I'm not the best set up person around and usually just copy a pro setup adjust based on the local conditions. I've ran 1.6s all around; 1.6s back/1.4's front; 1.4 all around; 1.4's back and the lap times and car feel is pretty much the same. Currently i'm sticking with 1.6's f/r. Hoping to stir up some setup discussion in here!
Just my two cents.....


Diameter (mm) 2 3 4
1.3 2.655 3.982 5.309
1.4 3.079 4.618 6.158
1.5 3.534 5.301 7.069
1.6 4.021 6.032 8.042
1.7 4.540 6.809 9.079


The 3x1.4 have a ratio of 4.6 which is very similar to the 2x1.7. If you used the same oil, let say 32wt Given the similar ratio, the slow speed movement (laminar flow) weight transfer or how the car corners will be the same. Given the larger hole size the 1.7 will be better on ruts and bumps, but the 3x1.4 will be pack a bit better on jumps when the flow increases (turbulent flow). If you like using the 2x1.6, then the 3x1.3 will feel similar but with more pack. I rather tune via piston first than oil, as going up in oil just slows down the piston speed so you don't bottom as fast until the spring pushes it up. But pack is better control using similar ratio but more holes. Try running 5x1.1 or 6x1.0 which gives at 4.7 ratio. It will pack way more with the same oil. But normally I find 5 or 6 holes too much for 10th scales.

Given the same oil, switching from 2x1.6 to 3x1.4, the ratio increases so you will have less pack, the car will feel like it may have more grip in corners, more steering off throttle and react quicker to driver input, but the the 1.6 will feel more stable especially in high speed sections of the track.
Normally if you are going from 2x1.6 to 3x1.4, you should go up 1 wt in oil to make it feel similar due to more flow from the pistons, or 1 wt down if going from 1.6..
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Old 08-25-2015, 10:49 AM   #15274
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Here is a great thread that talks about shock pistons, RC Shock Dyno Test Results

You may experience a headache because of information overload.
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Old 08-25-2015, 10:49 AM   #15275
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Originally Posted by mgers75 View Post
Nope no problems driving semi-fast and consistent. Ive seen that video of Wildcat driving at SRS and I'm pretty sure i'd lap him twice in a 6 min main haha (jk wildcat).......Perhaps the problem is I've never really tried changing pistons at track to do back-to-back comparisons because I hate messing with those e-clips and having to take the shock eyelet off to get to the piston and reseting the shock lengths. Would be a good reason to get the new shock shafts perhaps.

But what exactly do people like better about the 3 x 1.4 pistons. Do they have more pack and jump better but with the smaller holes still give the traction of a bigger piston? Sorry if i sound like an imbecile, but I'm not the best set up person around and usually just copy a pro setup adjust based on the local conditions. I've ran 1.6s all around; 1.6s back/1.4's front; 1.4 all around; 1.4's back and the lap times and car feel is pretty much the same. Currently i'm sticking with 1.6's f/r. Hoping to stir up some setup discussion in here!
A couple things:

The tracks in the SW seem to be much higher grip, and we seem to set the cars up to be very rear traction-centric. This helps immensely for drive off the corner.

The 1.4's in the front added more turn in, and made the car more planted coming off the corner. I felt like they were smoother when jumping, and calmed the car down.
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Old 08-25-2015, 12:58 PM   #15276
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Originally Posted by mgers75 View Post
But what exactly do people like better about the 3 x 1.4 pistons. Do they have more pack and jump better but with the smaller holes still give the traction of a bigger piston? Sorry if i sound like an imbecile, but I'm not the best set up person around and usually just copy a pro setup adjust based on the local conditions. I've ran 1.6s all around; 1.6s back/1.4's front; 1.4 all around; 1.4's back and the lap times and car feel is pretty much the same. Currently i'm sticking with 1.6's f/r. Hoping to stir up some setup discussion in here!
It all comes down to low speed damping vs high speed damping.

Low speed damping is how your car transitions through corners (traditional damping of suspension action so your car isn't a bouncy over-reacting mess) and how well it keeps the tire in contact with the track's surface.

High speed damping is how your car reacts to hard landings, larger bumps, and to some degree, very sudden suspension action through aggressive driving.

Smaller holes tend to cause the oil to pack up more (resist high speed movement, i.e. thicker high speed damping) than larger holes, so a piston with more holes that are smaller (say a 3x1.4) will pack up before a piston with less larger holes (say 2x1.6), assuming that you use the oil for each piston that would cause similar low speed damping (probably 2.5 - 5wt thicker oil in the 3x1.4s).

Time for some real world examples:

In the rear of the b5m, 2x1.7, 2x1.6, and 3x1.4 are all valid choices based on track conditions. I tend to always run 2x1.6, but I know from experience that 3x1.4 will offer more granular adjustment to how the car feels and I can work with a range of lighter damping to try and find traction without loss of pack. If I were to move to a 2x1.7 for lighter damping, I would suffer from a lack of pack most likely, and if I were to try going much south of 30wt with the 2x1.6, I will be taking very large steps that should be fine tuning. I find that 3x1.4s are good for looser situations that still have large jumps, and 1.7s are a good option if you're trying to remove pack on a super bumpy track, or you want very thick low speed damping without the car packing up like crazy on a jump landing and actually bouncing because the shock locked up, as would be the case if you used thick fluid in a 3x1.4. For me, I almost always run 1.6 in the rear because I rarely find myself willing to have the car "feel lighter" in search of traction, and I'd almost always prefer the feel of anything vs a 1.7 on our indoor and outdoor tracks.

The front of the b5m is a different story, but it's only because of the weight difference. In the front, 2x1.6s may not offer light enough low speed damping on some surfaces, and 3x1.4s will allow you to reach the range of damping you need while maintaining good pack and resistance to pitching and yawing. I tend to use flat 3x1.4s in the front, but I'm ready to move to a 1.6 if the right track comes along. Tapered 3x1.4s make the car steer like crazy, so think long and hard about using them anywhere except the rear of the car!

While we're at it, I feel I should mention the rear of the b44 platform, where 2x1.7s are my standard piston. I find that anything else in the rear of that car has too much pack for the low speed damping it brings. The front is also worth mention in that I've gone back and fourth between 3x1.4 and 2x1.6—on a super tight track, I may run 3x1.4 in the front of that car, but generally it offers too light of damping options and I stick with a 1.6. Note that there is significantly more weight in the front of a b44.3 than a b5m—the piston selection follows that point naturally.

Wayne
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Old 08-25-2015, 06:08 PM   #15277
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Any feedback on the Schelle aluminum stearing bushing set? Curious what the feedback on the buggy would be with either the up or down position compared to stock, centered.
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Old 08-25-2015, 06:44 PM   #15278
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I think ill stick with the 3 by 1.4 in the front to keep the front settled and the 2 by 1.6 in rear for that added traction even with a liitle lighter fluid
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Old 08-25-2015, 07:37 PM   #15279
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Any feedback on the Schelle aluminum stearing bushing set? Curious what the feedback on the buggy would be with either the up or down position compared to stock, centered.
With the axle in the up position, you have more aggressive steering, more turn in. Ideal on smooth tracks. Axle down slows down initial steering. Good on bumpy tracks. Middle axle is standard and should be baseline. Axle height should be one of those adjustments you make when you need that last little bit.

http://www.schelleracing.com/Associa...ng-Set-SCH1087
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Old 08-25-2015, 07:52 PM   #15280
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http://www.redrc.net/2015/08/t-works...gpin-bushings/



T-Works have introduced brass kingpin bushing sets for Team Associated’s fifth generation 1/10th off-road vehicles such as the B5 and T5. The parts help to alter the roll centre settings and also add unsprung weight which can be beneficial at certain track conditions. Available are a 4-piece standard, a 4-piece offset and an 8-piece “complete” set for the B5, T5 and SC5.





http://www.redrc.net/2015/08/rdrp-b5...bellcrank-set/



Made to replace the standard plastic steering bellcranks of Team Associated’s B5 series vehicles is the RDRP B5RM/MM aluminium bellcrank set. The parts do away with the kit’s plastic steering bellcranks in favour of stronger levers for added rigidity and better looks. The CNC-machined 7075-T6 aluminium construction considerably strengthens the steering assembly for less slop, a more precise steering reaction and less flex, resulting in a rock solid steering feeling and more durability in the event of a crash. The RDRP B5RM/MM bellcrank aluminium set is made for the use with fifth generation kits and it comes blue anodised and laser-etched to match the remainder of RDRP’s Team Associated option parts.



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Old 08-26-2015, 05:18 AM   #15281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas PA View Post
To help things get back on topic, I remember a while back people asking about the quality of the AC RC gear lowrider off of shapeways compared to the reds workshop. So, I have been running the AC RC one, with a slipper eliminator, and have yet to strip any gears. Gear mesh seems a little tight internally, and the reds has less internal resistance. But for the difference in price... I can live with that. Also note that the AC RC uses the old style top shaft and bearings. And if you want to save some extra coin on your low rider conversion, its pretty easy to replace the waterfall and battery strap with a carbon B5R strap and a turnbuckle to the gearbox, using shock eyelets on the turnbuckle. But the main question was, is it reliable? Yes
Thomas,

do you have the updated version of the gearbox? They released an improved version in july, if I remember correctly... I installed this one and I think in terms of resistance it's pretty much the same as the original AE 4 gear gearbox.
Another question:
Did you drill the two additional (optional) holes in the chassis to mount the gearbox with six screws instead of four?
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Old 08-26-2015, 05:32 AM   #15282
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Thomas,

do you have the updated version of the gearbox? They released an improved version in july, if I remember correctly... I installed this one and I think in terms of resistance it's pretty much the same as the original AE 4 gear gearbox.
Another question:
Did you drill the two additional (optional) holes in the chassis to mount the gearbox with six screws instead of four?
Yes, I do have the newest version, and I did drill the 2 extra holes. I suppose its possible that my 2 extra holes are a little off, and that's what's causing the resistance. I'm not experiencing a significant difference, but it does seem a little tight. Which is probably why nothing has stripped
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Old 08-26-2015, 06:51 AM   #15283
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Word up to the noobs: Think long and hard about getting an aluminum steering rack. That's one of the best ways to start going through servos you will ever find. The stock plastic rack provides some damping from impacts and will likely break before your servo will, especially if you have a reasonably tough servo. When I see people stripping gears in their servo, they almost always have an aluminum rack.

The stock b5 steering is already one of the tightest and nicest steering racks you will find on a car, and it breaks away during a hard impact.

My $0.02,

Wayne
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Old 08-26-2015, 07:08 AM   #15284
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Word up to the noobs: Think long and hard about getting an aluminum steering rack. That's one of the best ways to start going through servos you will ever find. The stock plastic rack provides some damping from impacts and will likely break before your servo will, especially if you have a reasonably tough servo. When I see people stripping gears in their servo, they almost always have an aluminum rack.

The stock b5 steering is already one of the tightest and nicest steering racks you will find on a car, and it breaks away during a hard impact.

My $0.02,

Wayne

I would definitely agree this is not one of the vehicles that benefits from an aluminum steering rack. In a bad enough hit to ruin your servo you are most likely going to also ruin that nifty aluminum rack and add to the cost of repairs, it adds nothing but bling. There is some slop in my front suspension but it all seems to come from the loose castor blocks on my car, I need some 1-2mm x 3mm nylon shims to tighten it up. The steering rack is one of the better ones I have seen and having the plastic adds some safety in hard hits.

After having made it through this entire thread, that took some time, I would like to get a waterfall fan mount and it seems the printed ones are not worth the effort as they fail pretty quickly. Is there any mfg that actually makes a molded waterfall fan mount?
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Old 08-26-2015, 07:28 AM   #15285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razathorn View Post
Word up to the noobs: Think long and hard about getting an aluminum steering rack. That's one of the best ways to start going through servos you will ever find. The stock plastic rack provides some damping from impacts and will likely break before your servo will, especially if you have a reasonably tough servo. When I see people stripping gears in their servo, they almost always have an aluminum rack.

The stock b5 steering is already one of the tightest and nicest steering racks you will find on a car, and it breaks away during a hard impact.

My $0.02,

Wayne
While this statement is true, more so for the ST and SCT, I have not broken a gear in the last 3+ years, since I went to all metal gear servos. I bought my car used wit the alum rack in it. Otherwise I would not have bought it. My daughter has the plastic one and bangs pipes like a monster and never broke the plastic rack. But on the ST I see the plastic racks getting shattered. Then they put on the alum rack and break the horns, then they put on the alum horns and now I see spindles break. No servos yet, but pretty much everything else in the steering. If you run a servo with a sacrificial gear, like airtronics. you will break it. One of the reasons, I ditched Airtronics servos. Protek, Xpert, and Hitec are taking some serious abuse in my cars.
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