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Old 08-14-2013, 03:54 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by Kromulous View Post
If this is the rule, wouldn't a B44.2 be Illegal? it only takes saddle packs only correct? I am probably missing something, so point it out if I am.

Shorty only 4wheel, bring it !

Thanks, Krom.
A saddle pack is a battery of maximum dimensions.
They measure the overall length end to end.
Making the kyosho and the b44.2 legal.
Or any car that can fit a saddle pack with out having to move anything but battery foam.

More specifically the spots that the saddle fit in or stick have to add up to a measurement 139mm as presented to technical inspection.

ROAR RULE
8.3.2.3.3
The maximum 2s brick/stick
case::
Length: 139mm
Width: 47mm
Height: 25.1mm

RULE 8.3.2.3.4
The maximum 2s saddle case:
Length:
139mm to be measured as two packs end to end as a maximum
Width:
47mm
Height:
25.1mm

Last edited by Nebula; 08-14-2013 at 04:05 PM. Reason: clarification
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:01 PM   #167
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It seems every time HB wins a race, Something has to be wrong, or they cheated or whatever. Cant people just accept that the HB cars are good cars, and stop hating on HB. The new D413 and Ty won, Its over. Move on to the worlds now.

+1....

This thread is going way off topic quick!
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:04 PM   #168
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I thought this thread was going to be about the awesome new D413 but apparently it's about vaginas *unsubscribe*.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:04 PM   #169
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I was ready to pull some Mortal Kombat 'fatality' moves on a couple of people.
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:16 PM   #170
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Someone should just name the manufacturer that protested.
Yeah I am interested. There were only a couple of manufacturers with more than one driver in the A main.
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:27 PM   #171
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:34 PM   #172
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this is like the dumbest rule ever, because if they were ever going to seem anything illegal, in the true "spirit" of running a traditional stick pack, then they should have outlawed saddle packs when they first appeared in pan cars decades ago.

otherwise, there's been instances at big races where guys have run 5-cell packs, so why the big stink over nothing? how long did we.txt variations of hump packs and it was okay?

I mean, unless it's some kind of oddball square pack or something, and as long as it doesn't violate the voltage rule, who cares except for whiners?

shorty pack = big tadoo about nothing imho.
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:42 PM   #173
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Sooo.... This thread is about the car, right? SOMEBODY has to have a picture of the car without the body on it. I don't care about the ROAR rules, my track doesn't run ROAR rules... I mean, who does? But anyway, this car looks good and I'm excited to finally see it.


And if HB is back into 1/10th scale.. and already has 1/10th drivers. How about they dust off the 'ol D2 that was never released!
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Old 08-14-2013, 04:56 PM   #174
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Originally Posted by hoonigantoo View Post
this is like the dumbest rule ever, because if they were ever going to seem anything illegal, in the true "spirit" of running a traditional stick pack, then they should have outlawed saddle packs when they first appeared in pan cars decades ago.

otherwise, there's been instances at big races where guys have run 5-cell packs, so why the big stink over nothing? how long did we.txt variations of hump packs and it was okay?

I mean, unless it's some kind of oddball square pack or something, and as long as it doesn't violate the voltage rule, who cares except for whiners?

shorty pack = big tadoo about nothing imho.
As I pointed out in my earlier post, the individual NiCd and NiMH cells had a nominal size with a tolerance; hence a maximum and minimum size. If you had 6 cells you could arrange them any way you liked.

I'm from the generation of racers who assembled their own packs from cells (which was not so long ago!) This was pretty much what everyone did. So, if you bought a saddle pack car, no problem, you'd just rearrange your current packs to fit (I did this often, I also raced 4 cell 12th). You can't do that with a full size LiPo.

Now, when LiPos came in, 99% of cars took either stick/ladder or saddle type packs. The 2S2P configuration of most LiPos at the time leant themselves to both stick and saddle configurations. So, there was mostly no problem. I say mostly because if you bought sticks you couldn't fit them in a saddle car, though the opposite isn't the case obviously.

Then shorty packs started appearing. Rather late in the piece ROAR realised the consequences of the way they had the LiPo battery dimensions worded with no minimum size, and introduced the rule we are now all discussing. Without this rule we could all very soon see chassis designed to take advantage of weird battery configurations and sizes, and vice versa. The end result will be a higher cost to the racer as special configurations cost more to produce and result in a faster turn over of electronics with reduced on-sell value.

Weight distribution is a big deal in RC car design. The rules on battery dimensions play a significant role in determining the layout of a car, and hence the weight distribution.
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Old 08-14-2013, 05:14 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Radio Active View Post

Now, when LiPos came in, 99% of cars took either stick/ladder or saddle type packs. The 2S2P configuration of most LiPos at the time leant themselves to both stick and saddle configurations. So, there was mostly no problem. I say mostly because if you bought sticks you couldn't fit them in a saddle car, though the opposite isn't the case obviously.

Then shorty packs started appearing. Rather late in the piece ROAR realised the consequences of the way they had the LiPo battery dimensions worded with no minimum size, and introduced the rule we are now all discussing. Without this rule we could all very soon see chassis designed to take advantage of weird battery configurations and sizes, and vice versa. The end result will be a higher cost to the racer as special configurations cost more to produce and result in a faster turn over of electronics with reduced on-sell value.

Weight distribution is a big deal in RC car design. The rules on battery dimensions play a significant role in determining the layout of a car, and hence the weight distribution.
but isn't that when it gets ridiculous, debating, if a car (such as this) in quick a saddle pack will fit, small changes can be made so a Shorty will fit.

if roar was going to make a statement against "odd sized" packs, and since the cars that saddles were designed for (pan cars) no longer used them, why not outlaw them?
have you seen some of the oddly-shaped configurations the make?
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Old 08-14-2013, 05:22 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by scott54 View Post
Sooo.... This thread is about the car, right? SOMEBODY has to have a picture of the car without the body on it. I don't care about the ROAR rules, my track doesn't run ROAR rules... I mean, who does? But anyway, this car looks good and I'm excited to finally see it.


And if HB is back into 1/10th scale.. and already has 1/10th drivers. How about they dust off the 'ol D2 that was never released!
SERIOUSLY!

But as far as the great battery debate of 2013: In my opinion if your car meets minimum weight and passes voltage testing, run it! But that is my opinion, I could be wrong...
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:13 PM   #177
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SERIOUSLY!

But as far as the great battery debate of 2013: In my opinion if your car meets minimum weight and passes voltage testing, run it! But that is my opinion, I could be wrong...
+1 who cares about anything else.
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:22 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by hoonigantoo View Post
but isn't that when it gets ridiculous, debating, if a car (such as this) in quick a saddle pack will fit, small changes can be made so a Shorty will fit.

if roar was going to make a statement against "odd sized" packs, and since the cars that saddles were designed for (pan cars) no longer used them, why not outlaw them?
have you seen some of the oddly-shaped configurations the make?
It's not just pan cars that were designed to use saddle packs. A significant portion of 4WD Offroad cars have been designed to use them since the 80s, and a few TCs as well.

It's not just about whether you can fit a regulation sized pack, but whether that configuration will be competitive. If it's not competitive then it's almost as good as it not fitting at all, and you have the same situation.

You do have a point in that ideally just one size of pack allowed would be ideal. You want one type of pack that fits in all cars. Thing is that saddles fit that description better than sticks or shortys at the moment.

Side note 1: I also think it was a mistake for 12th to specify 1S packs of different dimensions to half a saddle. You need cells for 12th now that you can't use for anything (except WGT), and that cuts down the number of people willing to try it.

Side note 2: You might also have noticed that there was an out-of-size saddle pack on ROAR's approved list a couple of years back. This pack was apparently grandfathered in from before the dimensions were set to what they are now. It was only removed after complaints from people that they'd brought it based on it's approval as a ROAR saddle pack only to find it didn't fit in their car.
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:56 PM   #179
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I see your point, not sure on my history of what car was the first to use a saddle pack, I thought it was the 12L or delta pan cars of the late 80s, but I could be wrong. I thought offroad followed them.

I was primarily talking about that, depending how you configure them, that saddle packs can make the oddest shape(s) of all.

you're right about the 1s packs, which just reinforces the idea to me that.there are too many sizes. it also reminds me of the Cheater Orion packs with the weight inserts. What about them?

that's why I think if the voltage is good and the size is close I'm okay with all of them.

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Originally Posted by Radio Active View Post
It's not just pan cars that were designed to use saddle packs. A significant portion of 4WD Offroad cars have been designed to use them since the 80s, and a few TCs as well.

It's not just about whether you can fit a regulation sized pack, but whether that configuration will be competitive. If it's not competitive then it's almost as good as it not fitting at all, and you have the same situation.

You do have a point in that ideally just one size of pack allowed would be ideal. You want one type of pack that fits in all cars. Thing is that saddles fit that description better than sticks or shortys at the moment.

Side note 1: I also think it was a mistake for 12th to specify 1S packs of different dimensions to half a saddle. You need cells for 12th now that you can't use for anything (except WGT), and that cuts down the number of people willing to try it.

Side note 2: You might also have noticed that there was an out-of-size saddle pack on ROAR's approved list a couple of years back. This pack was apparently grandfathered in from before the dimensions were set to what they are now. It was only removed after complaints from people that they'd brought it based on it's approval as a ROAR saddle pack only to find it didn't fit in their car.
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Old 08-14-2013, 07:05 PM   #180
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So basically if I were to get a 4WD Buggy it would be this one. Just so I could hopefully win and spread the butthurt haha!
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