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Old 08-13-2013, 11:58 AM   #136
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Originally Posted by JoeNolasco View Post
Interesting. Thanks for posting that up!
Sure thing Joe,

Forgot who actually posted it up a few pages back, so the thanks should go to that person.

Rule wise it's a little strange as I read the quoted rule.

Mainly because of how it could be applied to a few chassis' where mid motor would be used. At any rate, it all seems to be a moot point as 1.) The car was never hit with any rule in fraction at the time of Tech. 2.) It seems that rule may not longer even be there, which could make sense as the use of Shorty packs become more of the norm.

More head scratching. LOL..
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Old 08-13-2013, 12:22 PM   #137
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Unnamed manufacturer shouldn’t be crucified for this cowardly act if in case somebody does reveal who they are. Their own A-main drivers refused to partake in this bogus protest. Others pitting under their tent probably didn’t even know anything about it. It is probably, or at least hopefully, just a case of a couple of individuals under unnamed manufacturer’s employ acting on their own accord.
I would like to know who this unnamed manufacturer is. Are there privacy concerns with regards to ROAR rules? I would like to know, because it will make a difference to me...
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Old 08-13-2013, 02:23 PM   #138
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New car looks good. Cant wait to try it for myself.
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Old 08-13-2013, 02:37 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by Teufel Racing View Post
I know, since you asked, I went and looked as well,

Nothing there that I could find either? Maybe a running rule change has already happened.

FWIW,
This was the rule quoted;

Rule 8.2.3
All chassis in all electric classes (except those specifically noted) MUST accept batteries up to the maximum dimensions allowed for its application. The legality of a chassis will be determined as presented to technical inspection. Chassis that require a configuration change, and/or a modification to fit a battery of maximum dimensions will not be considered legal, and the racer will be disqualified. Foam blocks/spacers are permitted to secure any size battery in its position, but the aforementioned spacers may never be attached to the chassis. The only exception is 1/8 off-road where it’s common to use two battery packs to achieve the maximum 4S configuration, or to use a single 4S battery, which has a different specification. Only under these circumstances will the fitting of either configuration be considered legal, but the production chassis must still conform to batteries of the maximum allowable dimensions.
This rule only ever made it to the website at http://www.roarracing.com/?cat=26. This is more current than the rule book dated 2010.
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Old 08-13-2013, 03:01 PM   #140
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I would like to know who this unnamed manufacturer is. Are there privacy concerns with regards to ROAR rules? I would like to know, because it will make a difference to me...
I don't know the reason for all the anonymity as well but either Neobuggy or LiveRC first used the term "unnamed manufacturer" in their report. Everyone in attendance knew who were involved. I decided to go along with the anonymity in honor of their A-main drivers who refused to sign the protest. I have many friends who are sponsored by that team and I didn't want throw all of them under the bus for the actions of a couple of sore loser teammates.

Had Ty been robbed of his win then yeah names would have been named. The way things turned out our team is over it. We're just gonna enjoy our victory and start prepping for next month's big race. Still though I was livid Sunday afternoon. I was ready to pull some Mortal Kombat 'fatality' moves on a couple of people.
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Old 08-13-2013, 03:05 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by T. Deguzman View Post
I don't know the reason for all the anonymity as well but either Neobuggy or LiveRC first used the term "unnamed manufacturer" in their report. Everyone in attendance knew who were involved. I decided to go along with the anonymity in honor of their A-main drivers who refused to sign the protest. I have many friends who are sponsored by that team and I didn't want throw all of them under the bus for the actions of a couple of sore loser teammates.

Had Ty been robbed of his win then yeah names would have been named. The way things turned out our team is over it. We're just gonna enjoy our victory and start prepping for next month's big race. Still though I was livid Sunday afternoon. I was ready to pull some Mortal Kombat 'fatality' moves on a couple of people.
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Old 08-13-2013, 04:47 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by jmackani View Post
This rule only ever made it to the website at http://www.roarracing.com/?cat=26. This is more current than the rule book dated 2010.
Thanks,

That's explains why I didn't see it where I thought I had saw it. LOL.

Still scratching head. LOL.
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Old 08-13-2013, 11:53 PM   #143
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Looks very interesting! Is Hara getting one to race?
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Old 08-14-2013, 01:02 AM   #144
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Because ROAR wasn't following the their own rules at the Nats

And I do wish they would do away with that stupid rule.
The rule is there so that you don't need to buy a new set of batteries every time you buy a new chassis. Imagine the situation where every chassis manufacturer requires a different sized battery. Or where you can fit your standard sized battery in your new car, but it's uncompetitive because it has been designed for a different weight distribution.

The NiMH and NiCd rules had a stated size for the cells with a tolerance. It was an oversight not to include a minimum size for LiPos from the very beginning IMO (I said this when Losi first released their shorty pack).

HB have done the right thing by getting the car checked on this at Tech inspection. Just to be clear, I have no problem with HB's conduct. Incorrect rulings don't set precedents though, they're just incorrect rulings. As a competitor sometimes you don't realise a guy you're racing with is running an out of spec car until it comes to the mains, or even after. You're focussed on your own car, not those of other manufacturers, and generally you don't hang around the tech area looking to see what passes and what doesn't. So, what should you do when you realise late in the piece that something has slipped through?

As for the suggestion made above that only production cars should be able to be run at big events. Well, that would take a part of the fun away. And then where do you draw the line between a prototype and a production car someone has modified. The sport was built originally on modifying kits to make them raceable. I for one wouldn't want to lose that aspect of it.
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Old 08-14-2013, 01:26 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by Radio Active View Post
The rule is there so that you don't need to buy a new set of batteries every time you buy a new chassis. Imagine the situation where every chassis manufacturer requires a different sized battery. Or where you can fit your standard sized battery in your new car, but it's uncompetitive because it has been designed for a different weight distribution.

The NiMH and NiCd rules had a stated size for the cells with a tolerance. It was an oversight not to include a minimum size for LiPos from the very beginning IMO (I said this when Losi first released their shorty pack).

HB have done the right thing by getting the car checked on this at Tech inspection. Just to be clear, I have no problem with HB's conduct. Incorrect rulings don't set precedents though, they're just incorrect rulings. As a competitor sometimes you don't realise a guy you're racing with is running an out of spec car until it comes to the mains, or even after. You're focussed on your own car, not those of other manufacturers, and generally you don't hang around the tech area looking to see what passes and what doesn't. So, what should you do when you realise late in the piece that something has slipped through?

As for the suggestion made above that only production cars should be able to be run at big events. Well, that would take a part of the fun away. And then where do you draw the line between a prototype and a production car someone has modified. The sport was built originally on modifying kits to make them raceable. I for one wouldn't want to lose that aspect of it.
I have a hard time trying to justify why there needs to be rules anymore. Everyone just wants to do whatever the hell they want, whenever they want.
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:16 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by Radio Active View Post
The rule is there so that you don't need to buy a new set of batteries every time you buy a new chassis. Imagine the situation where every chassis manufacturer requires a different sized battery. Or where you can fit your standard sized battery in your new car, but it's uncompetitive because it has been designed for a different weight distribution.

The NiMH and NiCd rules had a stated size for the cells with a tolerance. It was an oversight not to include a minimum size for LiPos from the very beginning IMO (I said this when Losi first released their shorty pack).

HB have done the right thing by getting the car checked on this at Tech inspection. Just to be clear, I have no problem with HB's conduct. Incorrect rulings don't set precedents though, they're just incorrect rulings. As a competitor sometimes you don't realise a guy you're racing with is running an out of spec car until it comes to the mains, or even after. You're focussed on your own car, not those of other manufacturers, and generally you don't hang around the tech area looking to see what passes and what doesn't. So, what should you do when you realise late in the piece that something has slipped through?

As for the suggestion made above that only production cars should be able to be run at big events. Well, that would take a part of the fun away. And then where do you draw the line between a prototype and a production car someone has modified. The sport was built originally on modifying kits to make them raceable. I for one wouldn't want to lose that aspect of it.
so you dont think the consumer pays extra anyway for 3sets of parts for battery configuration and chassis milling and the R&D it takes to design a RC car that will be competitive with 3 battery options?

how long do we keep lipos anyway .....
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:20 AM   #147
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so you dont think the consumer pays extra anyway for 3sets of parts for battery configuration and chassis milling and the R&D it takes to design a RC car that will be competitive with 3 battery options?

how long do we keep lipos anyway .....
+1 my cars almost always outlast my batteries.....
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Old 08-14-2013, 10:57 AM   #148
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Originally Posted by Radio Active View Post
The rule is there so that you don't need to buy a new set of batteries every time you buy a new chassis. Imagine the situation where every chassis manufacturer requires a different sized battery. Or where you can fit your standard sized battery in your new car, but it's uncompetitive because it has been designed for a different weight distribution.

The NiMH and NiCd rules had a stated size for the cells with a tolerance. It was an oversight not to include a minimum size for LiPos from the very beginning IMO (I said this when Losi first released their shorty pack).

HB have done the right thing by getting the car checked on this at Tech inspection. Just to be clear, I have no problem with HB's conduct. Incorrect rulings don't set precedents though, they're just incorrect rulings. As a competitor sometimes you don't realise a guy you're racing with is running an out of spec car until it comes to the mains, or even after. You're focussed on your own car, not those of other manufacturers, and generally you don't hang around the tech area looking to see what passes and what doesn't. So, what should you do when you realise late in the piece that something has slipped through?

As for the suggestion made above that only production cars should be able to be run at big events. Well, that would take a part of the fun away. And then where do you draw the line between a prototype and a production car someone has modified. The sport was built originally on modifying kits to make them raceable. I for one wouldn't want to lose that aspect of it.

In hind sight, I misspoke. I meant that if ROAR were going to ignore the rule they should just delete it from their site. And notified everyone well before their biggest event that they were doing so

I agree 100% with what you said. Very well done.

The thing that happened that made me upset was that I was told that ROAR were aware of the the rule in tech. It was brought to their attention by people who thought their own cars were in violation. And the tech said that ROAR were not enforcing that rule this weekend and it was ok to run their car. This was at the start of the event.

So that meant a car that was in violation of the rule could have gone through tech a 1000 times and been deemed legal, because ROAR willfully ignored it.

So if somebody read the rule and tested their car in a legal configuration at their factory or home track. Then shows up to an event and the rule that they followed is thrown out with out any prior notification. They do not have the same courtesy of being able to try a configuration the breaks the posted rules online. Possibly giving a performance advantage.
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:11 PM   #149
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They need to update their damn rule book. Its ridiculous. Who know what the rules are if you have to hunt around on their site to find these "updates" posted a year ago and their rule book says updated in 2011.
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:13 PM   #150
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Sure thing Joe,

Forgot who actually posted it up a few pages back, so the thanks should go to that person.


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