Diff balls
05-25-2013, 08:16 AM
#1
Diff balls
Guys
Sorry to post it here, but tamiya trf502 tread is slow and quiet...
I need help with the trf502x diff balls
Looking at the manual I see one type of balls BA18, but when looking at the end page for PN I see another type BA19 (looks smaller balls).
Which type is the one I need?
Are the balls for the rear diff and the front diff are the same?
In the BA18 it says x24 balls, and in the BA19 it says x16 ball, how many do I need?
I also didn't find in the web the 15700147 PN wich is for the BA18, can you advice with a link to buy?
Thanks
Eran
Sorry to post it here, but tamiya trf502 tread is slow and quiet...
I need help with the trf502x diff balls
Looking at the manual I see one type of balls BA18, but when looking at the end page for PN I see another type BA19 (looks smaller balls).
Which type is the one I need?
Are the balls for the rear diff and the front diff are the same?
In the BA18 it says x24 balls, and in the BA19 it says x16 ball, how many do I need?
I also didn't find in the web the 15700147 PN wich is for the BA18, can you advice with a link to buy?
Thanks
Eran
05-25-2013, 07:37 PM
#2
It depends on which ones you're trying to replace. Ball diffs today use 2 types, the smaller ones are for the thrust assembly(sits inline with the diff adjustment screw, should be 8 of them per diff) & the larger ones are for the diff gear itself(though as I don't own a 502X, I don't know if they're 3mm ones or 3/32" ones, like the TRF201 uses), & the diff gear uses 12 of those....
05-26-2013, 09:15 AM
#3
The main diff balls are 3/32, just like any Team Associated, or TLR 1/10th scale diff and you need 12 of them for each diff. The thrust bearing requires 1/16 size balls and 8 of them for each diff. All of this information is in the manual, which is available online. As for where to get the diff balls, anywhere that has those sizes will work. Some of us build diffs to very tight specs, and therefore need/want certain components to be a certain quality. You still need to learn how to build and set up your diffs, so for you it really doesn't matter. You are going to destroy diff after diff in the learning process, and to be completely honest, I doubt you will ever get it to the point where you can build a really good diff. Most people never really get good at building diffs. The right components, and a proper break in, are the most important things. Anyone can rebuild a diff with the right parts and get it to be smooth for a while, but a diff that stays smooth for a long time is the mark of someone that truly knows how to correctly build and set up a diff. Shame too, because cars handle so much better with a good diff. Ever wonder why the pros make it look so easy? It is because they are so good at making the car do what they want, using setup changes and proper car building techniques. It is so much easier to go fast when your car is perfect.
Understood Thanks a lot
The only thing I don't understand is why need a setup? It look so easy and you knows - you need to place the balls in the holes and that all, like in this movie
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=M_u9y...%3DM_u9yKV2TPM
Last edited by badaml; 05-26-2013 at 09:24 PM. Reason: Quoted content.
05-26-2013, 04:36 PM
#4
Suspended
05-26-2013, 05:04 PM
#5
Actually on the bench you may want to have the gear slip a little depending on your breakin process and if you like to run a loose diff. The opposite can be just as bad by putting dents in the rings. The rear wheels will never be totally locked like that when your on the track. I agree that video is not at all how I do it either, it's way easier and faster than he makes it look. And as you said, it's all about the breakin anyway. A well built diff can last for months of weekly racing. If you like to run a loose diff you do need to be careful to not roach it when in a car jam or trying to flip your buddys car over in practice.
05-26-2013, 09:27 PM
#6
Actually the diff balls you choose will have something to do with how your diff works and feels. Break-in is also important.
There are two primary grades of carbide diff balls, #25 and #10. The #10 balls are "rounder" and more uniform. Remember there are manufacturing tolerances in everything, including 3/32" carbide balls, so the #10 balls are better.
To begin with, it makes sense that if your diff balls are not round you diff will not be smooth.
You put 12 balls in the diff, and the carbide balls are the toughest thing in there, far tougher than the diff rings. If one of the balls is a bit larger than the rest, you are really only using one ball. That ball will wear the ring more than the others and ring wear will be quicker because you are doing all the work with just one ball. No matter how far the ring wears, you will still be only using one ball.
On the other hand, if one ball is smaller than the rest, you are only using 11 -- may as well leave the small one out. I certainly don't have the equipment to measure diff balls; even a typical micrometer won't be accurate enough.
Solution is make sure you buy #10 balls. X Factory #6500 diff balls are #10.
There are two primary grades of carbide diff balls, #25 and #10. The #10 balls are "rounder" and more uniform. Remember there are manufacturing tolerances in everything, including 3/32" carbide balls, so the #10 balls are better.
To begin with, it makes sense that if your diff balls are not round you diff will not be smooth.
You put 12 balls in the diff, and the carbide balls are the toughest thing in there, far tougher than the diff rings. If one of the balls is a bit larger than the rest, you are really only using one ball. That ball will wear the ring more than the others and ring wear will be quicker because you are doing all the work with just one ball. No matter how far the ring wears, you will still be only using one ball.
On the other hand, if one ball is smaller than the rest, you are only using 11 -- may as well leave the small one out. I certainly don't have the equipment to measure diff balls; even a typical micrometer won't be accurate enough.
Solution is make sure you buy #10 balls. X Factory #6500 diff balls are #10.
05-27-2013, 01:06 AM
#7
Suspended
iTrader: (7)
Actually on the bench you may want to have the gear slip a little depending on your breakin process and if you like to run a loose diff. The opposite can be just as bad by putting dents in the rings. The rear wheels will never be totally locked like that when your on the track. I agree that video is not at all how I do it either, it's way easier and faster than he makes it look. And as you said, it's all about the breakin anyway. A well built diff can last for months of weekly racing. If you like to run a loose diff you do need to be careful to not roach it when in a car jam or trying to flip your buddys car over in practice.
Actually the diff balls you choose will have something to do with how your diff works and feels. Break-in is also important.
There are two primary grades of carbide diff balls, #25 and #10. The #10 balls are "rounder" and more uniform. Remember there are manufacturing tolerances in everything, including 3/32" carbide balls, so the #10 balls are better.
To begin with, it makes sense that if your diff balls are not round you diff will not be smooth.
You put 12 balls in the diff, and the carbide balls are the toughest thing in there, far tougher than the diff rings. If one of the balls is a bit larger than the rest, you are really only using one ball. That ball will wear the ring more than the others and ring wear will be quicker because you are doing all the work with just one ball. No matter how far the ring wears, you will still be only using one ball.
On the other hand, if one ball is smaller than the rest, you are only using 11 -- may as well leave the small one out. I certainly don't have the equipment to measure diff balls; even a typical micrometer won't be accurate enough.
Solution is make sure you buy #10 balls. X Factory #6500 diff balls are #10.
There are two primary grades of carbide diff balls, #25 and #10. The #10 balls are "rounder" and more uniform. Remember there are manufacturing tolerances in everything, including 3/32" carbide balls, so the #10 balls are better.
To begin with, it makes sense that if your diff balls are not round you diff will not be smooth.
You put 12 balls in the diff, and the carbide balls are the toughest thing in there, far tougher than the diff rings. If one of the balls is a bit larger than the rest, you are really only using one ball. That ball will wear the ring more than the others and ring wear will be quicker because you are doing all the work with just one ball. No matter how far the ring wears, you will still be only using one ball.
On the other hand, if one ball is smaller than the rest, you are only using 11 -- may as well leave the small one out. I certainly don't have the equipment to measure diff balls; even a typical micrometer won't be accurate enough.
Solution is make sure you buy #10 balls. X Factory #6500 diff balls are #10.
Look at it like this. If you had the money, you could build an exact replica of Cav's or Tebo's car. You would have all the right components, but unless you have the skill, you will not win any more races than with the jalopy you normally race. Point is if you are not good at it, you are not good at it, be it driving, diff building, or any other skill. Only way to get better is to practice, and pay attention. All that said, I am really really really good at building cars, and if I had the time, I am fairly confident that I could be a pro driver. I build my stuff to very high tolerances. I test things as empirically as possible, and I have been doing this for a long time. I take pride in my skill, and I'm good enough at this to notice the really small differences all these thing make. I call people out when they are not good at something. Do you know why? Because maybe if instead of codling those that are not good, I force them to feel a little frowny about their lack of skill, it might modivate them to do something about it. Then, I get chastised for this, and my posts get deleted. Hugs and trophies for everyone, you guys are all really great car builders, and are all pro level drivers on the inside, which is where it counts.
Also, I am going to keep a copy of this post in case I need to put it up again. This post does not insult anyone, yet if it gets deleted, I will not be surprised.
Kavee, if you are not from Poland, where do you live?
05-27-2013, 11:07 AM
#8
Never let a diff slip. Slip a diff one time, and the diff is on a slow boat to self destruction. Set a diff, and the lock down the slipper. Go jump the car, and land full throttle. It will bark the diff. Slippers are not traction control, they are suspension for the drivetrain. Part of proper diff setup is a proper slipper setting.
There are umpteen companies that make high quality diff balls. There are even companies that make other really high quality diff parts that are just as key. Thing is though, none of that matters if you don't break in and set the tension exactly perfect.
Look at it like this. If you had the money, you could build an exact replica of Cav's or Tebo's car. You would have all the right components, but unless you have the skill, you will not win any more races than with the jalopy you normally race. Point is if you are not good at it, you are not good at it, be it driving, diff building, or any other skill. Only way to get better is to practice, and pay attention. All that said, I am really really really good at building cars, and if I had the time, I am fairly confident that I could be a pro driver. I build my stuff to very high tolerances. I test things as empirically as possible, and I have been doing this for a long time. I take pride in my skill, and I'm good enough at this to notice the really small differences all these thing make. I call people out when they are not good at something. Do you know why? Because maybe if instead of codling those that are not good, I force them to feel a little frowny about their lack of skill, it might modivate them to do something about it. Then, I get chastised for this, and my posts get deleted. Hugs and trophies for everyone, you guys are all really great car builders, and are all pro level drivers on the inside, which is where it counts.
Also, I am going to keep a copy of this post in case I need to put it up again. This post does not insult anyone, yet if it gets deleted, I will not be surprised.
Kavee, if you are not from Poland, where do you live?
There are umpteen companies that make high quality diff balls. There are even companies that make other really high quality diff parts that are just as key. Thing is though, none of that matters if you don't break in and set the tension exactly perfect.
Look at it like this. If you had the money, you could build an exact replica of Cav's or Tebo's car. You would have all the right components, but unless you have the skill, you will not win any more races than with the jalopy you normally race. Point is if you are not good at it, you are not good at it, be it driving, diff building, or any other skill. Only way to get better is to practice, and pay attention. All that said, I am really really really good at building cars, and if I had the time, I am fairly confident that I could be a pro driver. I build my stuff to very high tolerances. I test things as empirically as possible, and I have been doing this for a long time. I take pride in my skill, and I'm good enough at this to notice the really small differences all these thing make. I call people out when they are not good at something. Do you know why? Because maybe if instead of codling those that are not good, I force them to feel a little frowny about their lack of skill, it might modivate them to do something about it. Then, I get chastised for this, and my posts get deleted. Hugs and trophies for everyone, you guys are all really great car builders, and are all pro level drivers on the inside, which is where it counts.
Also, I am going to keep a copy of this post in case I need to put it up again. This post does not insult anyone, yet if it gets deleted, I will not be surprised.
Kavee, if you are not from Poland, where do you live?
Ho well let's say I understand that
I will not able to build a good diff at the moment, I am a rookie. Only a year in the hobby.
My friend have ceramic 3/32 balls for me and I will buy the 1/16 balls
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tamiya-42193...item20bb0d65f4
Are they good?
I hope my friend will teach me how to build it good...
Last question which grease should I buy for this?
Ifuonlyknew - I am from Israel but my parents are polish
05-27-2013, 07:18 PM
#9
Suspended
iTrader: (7)
Ho well let's say I understand that
I will not able to build a good diff at the moment, I am a rookie. Only a year in the hobby.
My friend have ceramic 3/32 balls for me and I will buy the 1/16 balls
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tamiya-42193...item20bb0d65f4
Are they good?
I hope my friend will teach me how to build it good...
Last question which grease should I buy for this?
Ifuonlyknew - I am from Israel but my parents are polish
I will not able to build a good diff at the moment, I am a rookie. Only a year in the hobby.
My friend have ceramic 3/32 balls for me and I will buy the 1/16 balls
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tamiya-42193...item20bb0d65f4
Are they good?
I hope my friend will teach me how to build it good...
Last question which grease should I buy for this?
Ifuonlyknew - I am from Israel but my parents are polish
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