godofcable

iTrader: (37)

I race in about 10 different classes depending on the track, and each of my boys race one class each. that's a lot of transponders.

I put a short extension into each of my cars, and plug the transponder into it. Much less chance of damaging the lead or the plug end when you have to swap to a different car.

Grandturk

iTrader: (5)

Not saying you can't race more than one class with only one transponder - just don't do it at the same time. It never works out and always causes delays.

godofcable

iTrader: (37)

im never late to the line, nor are my kids. Its up to the individual racer to be ready on time.

but thats not the point of this thread.

to the OP, im with everyone else. Rule 3 is all you really need

xlayedoutx

iTrader: (4)

Besides the smartass answers from asc6000, everything was very useful. We are trying to make it as fair as we can for everybody who wants to race but coming out without a transponder, or having one that is not reading is not fair to everyone else that spent the money for them and has them working.

The problem is after the race when we go to announce the winners and someone comes up and says hey I won but my transponder wasn't counting and didn't count for the whole race. If we go ahead and award the win to this driver then what is the point of having the transponder system in the first place? If they know the rules up front and their transponder does not check in before the race they can still race for fun but in my eyes shouldn't expect points for the series, and now if they say they won the race and want a trophy it's their word against the guy with the working transponder that the systems says won.

Just trying to come up with a set of rules for this sort of thing so that everyone at our track knows what to expect from the beginning.

xlayedoutx

iTrader: (4)

Most agree that rule number 3 is the only one needed, but how do you handle or make a rule for the guy that shows up without a transponder and says he won or placed and everybody with a transponder is saying that it's not fair?

Just a FYI we had 56 entries this weekend and there were maybe 4 guys without a transponder. One of those won the main but we had a lot of people upset that he was given the win without a transponder.

aloksatoor

iTrader: (43)

The average life of a transponder is way beyond most motors/escs chassis. Just don't race classes like a madman then if you have only a couple or so. Plus look at the resale value of transponders, its way higher than any RC part.

xlayedoutx

iTrader: (4)

Maybe I should have titled the thread no transponder rule. We try our best with Rule#3 but what we need is a way to handle the guys who show up without a transponder that makes it fair for the guys who have them.

aloksatoor

iTrader: (43)

Yep for series with a 100 plus turnout expected, our RD just bans people without PTs. Theres no way house transponders will get everyone home at a decent time! For club racing in summers he provides house transponders.

Sneaky Pete

iTrader: (4)

We use #3 and #6 at our track. At the end of the day, your personal transponder is just another piece of race equipment - like your radio. If your radio runs out of juice, it's not the race director's fault, it's yours.

RC*PHREAK

iTrader: (146)

i believe the ROAR rules are that if your transponder isn't working or stops working, you're SOL. IMO, this is the way it should be. you're equipment failed. same as if you're esc or motor crapped out.

the reason i don't like rule #3 is that it might not get equally applied. if you're one of the popular guys and your friends keep a close eye on your race, if your transponder craps out, they yell up to the RD that the transponder isn't working and now the RD hand counts. what if you're the guy who shows up by himself and doesn't have a cheering section? yeah, the RD will probably notice if you're top 3, but what if it's a series race and you're running 5 or 6? will you get the same hand count privilege?

if every race is video'd, then yeah, that's a great way to settle debates. we had one recently where a kid's transponder crapped out and his relative who was taping it brought it to the attention of the RD after the fact. well what happens next time when he's not there to tape it? or, heaven forbid, if a competitor's transponder cuts out, would he offer up the video footage (totally not the case in our specific incident as the video guy is a straight up dude, but you can see where it might get dicey).

fq06

iTrader: (12)

I think you should have a working transponder and get to the stand in time.

I assume you don't have handouts.
Those that have transponders race regularly and if they show up and it's not working, it's probably news to them.
Your track is there for profit right? Why turn a customer away when you may be losing a paying customer(s) in the future? When the situation allows, and you don't have multiple unprepared racers... why not hand count the one or two unfortunate racers (different classes of course) that gave you their hard earned money in exchange for entertainment. This is for fun right? How many of us profit from this hobby?

What about the basher that hears about this series and wants to try his hand at racing for the first time? No transponder? Possibly no future revenue for your series from this person. Maybe that basher could give you a $100 deposit to use your old beat up amb for the day?
Said basher liked it and buys his own transponder to become a regularly paying customer.

The announcer is there to make money too and gets paid based on how many people race so why wouldn't at least the announcer do his best to get as many racers returning.

If my transponder goes out mid race and you catch it... hand count my laps, it won't kill you.
If I show up at the line first heat of the day and my transponder crapped out without me knowing it... your really going to tell me to just go home (no working transponder=DNS)? Your not going to put in one ounce of effort to make my day enjoyable?

Lots of other thought on this, but that was all the effort I wanted to put into it.

Dave H

Maybe not the answer you’re looking for, but one of the newer tracks in my area doesn't have any house transponders either. So they have a few personals on hand that they rent out for something like $5 I think it is. Not sure but I think they hold your driver’s license as collateral until the PT is returned. Granted some up front expense involved, but at least it’s new racer/potential new racer friendly.

kja812

iTrader: (3)

Our club owns extra transponders and rents them out for $5/race so everyone has one. No transponder - you're just doing laps for fun. In the RD booth, we try to notify a racer if we notice their transponder isn't working. We try to manually add the laps but there is no guarantees. A bad transponder is no different than any other equipment failure, it ends your race in many cases.

Zerodefect

Still, there would be a pattern of that with multiple drivers. AMB systems are quite robust.

And you're correct, the problem needs addressed right away. RD's can't be expected to make up for blown Txp's or Loops. Newer AMB systems often alarm a weak signal from a car, but I'm unsure what software has that capability.

The tracks have to:
-make sure the loop is connected proper and that they are useing the correct cable to reach the loop.
-not to bury the cable too deep. (I've never been to a track this stupid.)

The racers have to:
-make sure thier Txp is in good condition. If another Txp solves your problem......
-mount it in a good location. I have no pity for some chump that bolts it on top of thier servo.
-make sure thier car isn't a faraday cage. (no metal Rx boxes, avoid strengthening the body with Aluminum tape in the area the Txp is in, try to mount the Txp high in Al chassis cars like in top of the Rx box not the bottom)

Zerodefect

I'll agree it's nice having a couple house Txp's on hand for such things. But there has been an epidemic of hack mechanic racers that can never keep thier stuff working and hold up the raceday too much. A little help is cool, but sometimes the Q has to start without someone.

The RD is allready taxed with calling out the order, calling drivethru penalties, calling 10spot grid penalties, getting everyone checked in, and generally organizing the raceday.

It is NOT easy. It's a F'n PITA. It's $15. The service is on par with the pay.

If the RD can catch your laps, that's nice. But it's unfair to the other racers, for him to spend all his time watching a car instead of his other duties.

If I know the RD is busy watching a car, I'm going to commit every hack and drivethru penalty offense I can without worry.