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Old 12-04-2012, 03:16 PM   #9031
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Here is my bumpsteer elimination mod... vuala, zero bump steer.

-The entire assembly needs to be shimmed up 2mm under the two pivot arms.

-Flat/short metric non-locking nuts underneath the ackerman plate

-1mm spacer under the inner ball studs. Spacer height under the inner ball studs JUST high enough to keep the bottom of the ballstud from poking out the bottom of the nut ...needs to be flush (MAKE SURE TO USE BLUE LOCKTITE!) Clearance is VERY close to the control arms. I am currently running the rear ackerman hole (not set on it, but seems to provide very smooth steering)



-2mm normal-ol outer bumpsteer washers.



i realize im digging pretty deep here, but i just wanted to clearify. This mod uses 2mm shims UNDER the 2 bellcranks. Does that mean to use the gold 2mm spacers directly under the bearings? Are longer screws needed to reach the steering rack mount (#320124-11 in the manual)

Thanks
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Old 12-04-2012, 04:52 PM   #9032
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Originally Posted by ErnestHelmsley View Post
err no.
No I didn't read that the 210 has more rear bias or no the motor placement doesn't affect front-rear weight bias or no a MM 210 cannot be lighter in the rear than a B4?

1. I did read that the 210 in RM has more rear bias than other buggies. Honestly you are the first I have read to say otherwise. Please note I am not saying you're wrong.
2. I am 100% sure motor placement affects weight bias on the 210.
3. You just claimed a B4 has more weight on the rear than a RM 210. Ergo, if my point #2 is true, you have also acknowledged that a MM 210 is lighter in the rear than a B4.

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why would you be comparing a mid motor to a rear motor..
Because the 210 can be configured in MM. It is a tuning option designed into the car to tune the handling. Neither you or the poster you were responding to stated referring only to RM setups. To not consider MM on the 210 would be akin to not consider moving the battery forward or backwards in a B4 to alter the weight bias.

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the b4 all setup has more weight in the rear than the 210 rm, you don't believe me go to the track and compare your 210 to a b4.1 wc properly set up. the b4 had more weight to the rear.
I neither claimed the 210 was heavier in the rear than a B4 or that I didn't believe you. I stated that's what I read. I do not have a 210 in hand as it is a Xmas gift for my 13 year old son. But I have been reading a lot about this car so that I can help him set it up properly. I have researched quite a bit on this car even before purchasing. No I do not have many posts...here...but I have been around for a while.

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tours why you see the b4 runing stiffer springs and pistons compared to a similar 210
You mean stiffer springs and more dampening? That may be the case, or not, I do not know. What I do know is that there are more factors than just the total weight on the rear tires that dictate what spring rate and dampening to run on a car.



Sean
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:04 PM   #9033
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Originally Posted by jzwolen View Post
i realize im digging pretty deep here, but i just wanted to clearify. This mod uses 2mm shims UNDER the 2 bellcranks. Does that mean to use the gold 2mm spacers directly under the bearings? Are longer screws needed to reach the steering rack mount (#320124-11 in the manual)

Thanks
You are correct, the 2mm spacers go underneath the bearings. You don't necessarily need longer screws because if you go with 2mm spacer underneath the pivot arms you will have to remove that tiny countersunk plastic holder for the two screws that mounts the pivot arms to the base. Otherwise the servo will no longer sit flush into its place. Use button head screws from then on. An extra 2mm on the two screws can't hurt, just make sure there still flush with the bottom of the chassis.

I personally went with only using 1mm underneath the arms, but this only works if you use a 3mm ackerman plate.
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:19 PM   #9034
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hi guys, new to this thread and the buggy world but ive had the desc for a bit now. in love with durango.

with that said, i bought a new rtr buggy (i didnt have another esc and motor so i bought the rtr) anyway i have my NEW buggy torn down lol. i put all my radio gear in it and a better servo and calibrated everything and noticed the tranny was tight. there was also diff fluid all over the left drive cup. i got it all apart and everything seems ok besides the mass amount of grease on the gears. i think what was binding it up was the little plastic out drive caps. those are coming off and staying off.
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:22 PM   #9035
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Originally Posted by Radi0Flyer View Post
No I didn't read that the 210 has more rear bias or no the motor placement doesn't affect front-rear weight bias or no a MM 210 cannot be lighter in the rear than a B4?

1. I did read that the 210 in RM has more rear bias than other buggies. Honestly you are the first I have read to say otherwise. Please note I am not saying you're wrong.
2. I am 100% sure motor placement affects weight bias on the 210.
3. You just claimed a B4 has more weight on the rear than a RM 210. Ergo, if my point #2 is true, you have also acknowledged that a MM 210 is lighter in the rear than a B4.


Because the 210 can be configured in MM. It is a tuning option designed into the car to tune the handling. Neither you or the poster you were responding to stated referring only to RM setups. To not consider MM on the 210 would be akin to not consider moving the battery forward or backwards in a B4 to alter the weight bias.


I neither claimed the 210 was heavier in the rear than a B4 or that I didn't believe you. I stated that's what I read. I do not have a 210 in hand as it is a Xmas gift for my 13 year old son. But I have been reading a lot about this car so that I can help him set it up properly. I have researched quite a bit on this car even before purchasing. No I do not have many posts...here...but I have been around for a while.


You mean stiffer springs and more dampening? That may be the case, or not, I do not know. What I do know is that there are more factors than just the total weight on the rear tires that dictate what spring rate and dampening to run on a car.



Sean
The only person i have ever heard use the word "ergo" in a sentence was the architect in the matrix movies. Maybe i need to get out into the real world a bit more.

But i can't help but wonder how comparing the weight bias of one car to another will dictate your set up preference. Please explain and maybe someone can provide the answer you seek.
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Old 12-05-2012, 12:37 AM   #9036
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Originally Posted by zipperfoot View Post

But i can't help but wonder how comparing the weight bias of one car to another will dictate your set up preference. Please explain and maybe someone can provide the answer you seek.
I wasn't, 05PSD was asking in post 9016. I only offered that in my research, it was indicated that the DEX210 was heavy in the rear compared to other buggies. But this was written on the internet so who knows if it's even true right.


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Old 12-05-2012, 02:08 AM   #9037
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i have 1mm washers under both steering link ball studs and i have no bump steer i do have a cf rack with no adjustment holes and upgraded cups n balls no idea brands ,,whats a good setup for a pretty inconstant sticky cold wet clay track most run slicks i am i can do wheelies in most areas then some corners my rear slides off power easily or on power wheel spinning my rear has a 1.5 kick up 3 toe in and im sure my inserts in the rear hubs have me at over 6* toe in with 0 hub inserts is that maybe my problem? ,and what pistons are others using im thinking two hole taperd , im using 4 hole f/r 35wt front losi 2.5 rate springs a little lighter than light red springs, 30wt rear light blue springs

Last edited by P6; 12-05-2012 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:56 AM   #9038
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All this talk of the captain America mod... I just flip the ball stud to the bottom side.... I remember reading this oon oople forums. Yet to be proven, but bench tests show the results as a change in the right direction.
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Old 12-05-2012, 06:37 AM   #9039
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Originally Posted by Radi0Flyer View Post
Thanks Neil.

Unfortunately I'm from Sudbury, not very local at all. I wish we had something like that further north.

I was just browsing the Universal website and noticed the buggy class is rear-motor only. Kinda defeats the purpose of buying a DEX210 (or Losi 22). Not looking to race the complete points or trophy series but if that's what's going on the day I'm down there I would like to be able to run the car anyway. Are they real sticklers for this rule for casual racers who may only participate a few times a year? Or can the RM setups on the 210 run with the other buggies? What I'm reading is the 210 is rear-heavy to begin with.

I don't actually have the car in hand yet so I'm trying to anticipate what springs and shock oil weight to get beforehand. I have been looking at setups on the Petit Racing links that have been posted but most of the setups are running much faster motors than the one my son will. (his buggy really) I was hoping to start him off near 13.5ish. He has a Duratrax Elements setup (3900kv) on 2s in his HPI Blitz and I think it's too much motor for him right now. He's only 13 and hasn't raced but a handful of races so he's very green.


Sean
Hi Sean,
Universal runs "1/10 2WD Buggy Open" (meaning you can run MM or RM) and "1/10 2WD Buggy Rear Motor only". There are usually only 4-6 guys running RM and 15-20 running MM, so don't worry about running MM. I'm running a Tekin GenII 8.5 and love it. That 13.5 will likely not get you over the triple that is currently there, but will be a good starting point for your son (or you ).

Neil
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:15 AM   #9040
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Originally Posted by Radi0Flyer View Post
I wasn't, 05PSD was asking in post 9016. I only offered that in my research, it was indicated that the DEX210 was heavy in the rear compared to other buggies. But this was written on the internet so who knows if it's even true right.


Sean
Who can say for sure if the 210 is heavier in the rear without actually weighing them and comparing.

I can see how there might be the perception that the 210 is heavy in the rear due to the amount of parts and screws that make up the rear of the car. Takes a little more work to change rear arms and get to the tranny. Conversely the front end of the car is easy to work on. Two screws and the servo assembly pulls out. Four screws and the whole front end can be lifted up giving access to the steering rack.

I did notice when switching from the B4.1 worlds to the 210, that the battery can be placed pretty far forward on the 210 without losing rear traction. So there may already be some weight on the tail end.

Anyway you look at it the 210 has a gaggle of parts that are made in brass to use as weight. Front or rear there are weight options. I run my buggy rm3 with a shorty battery against the front battery stop. I did add 14gm of weight to the rear just in front of the tranny. The buggy seems well balanced to me and jumps perfectly level with little effort. Hope this helps.
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:30 AM   #9041
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Originally Posted by Azagar View Post
You are correct, the 2mm spacers go underneath the bearings. You don't necessarily need longer screws because if you go with 2mm spacer underneath the pivot arms you will have to remove that tiny countersunk plastic holder for the two screws that mounts the pivot arms to the base. Otherwise the servo will no longer sit flush into its place. Use button head screws from then on. An extra 2mm on the two screws can't hurt, just make sure there still flush with the bottom of the chassis.

I personally went with only using 1mm underneath the arms, but this only works if you use a 3mm ackerman plate.

i am running a 3mm CF ackerman plate, so maybe i'll start with 1mm and see what happens.
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:05 PM   #9042
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Ran the RTR chassis last night and wow..huge difference in my car..I couldn't believe how much better it made my 210..
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:07 PM   #9043
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Ran the RTR chassis last night and wow..huge difference in my car..I couldn't believe how much better it made my 210..
I would absolutely agree.. I think it may even be better than the dimec20? Softer equals traction.
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:55 PM   #9044
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Originally Posted by Raul Garcia View Post
I would absolutely agree.. I think it may even be better than the dimec20? Softer equals traction.
The track I ran on last night is a small indoor clay track..and it's hooked up as far as traction goes, I could take the sweeper and not have to lift..so much better hi speed steering, theirs a double double on this track if you don't take the "right" line you'll end up on your lid, with the +8 chassis I could hit it anywhere and be ok..no problems..out of ALL my cars this is my favorite..guys if you haven't tried one you should..
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:16 PM   #9045
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The plastic chassis is much better in my opinion as well. At my local track there is a jump right after the sweeper and if you were not squared up while hitting the jump, you would land on your lid. After swapping chassis, I can carry more corner speed with out having to square up completely because the dimec 20 chassis doesn't get upset nearly as much. Another thing I noticed is that if you slightly case a jump the car doesn't flip over nearly as easily as the aluminum chassis would.
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