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Old 11-10-2011, 02:31 PM   #1741
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Originally Posted by Jonny5 View Post
Would you care to explain why you think this? I'm not saying it isn't so, but the orientation of the washers should not matter provided that the races are pretty facing the caged thrust. There is a set dimension of the bore that the thrust assembly goes into, defined by the outdrive and the circlip. There is also a set dimension of the thrust assembly- whether you have the larger washer in the hole first or last does not change the overall dimension, nor does it affect the depth at which the diff bolt rests. Maybe I'm missing something. I totally agree that the orientation of the circlip is crucial, but the way I see it the washers should not affect anything. Maybe I'm missing something..
Ok I don't have the parts sitting in front of me but this is how it should be. The washer with the smaller ID goes on the screw first. The smaller hole should be somewhat snug on the screw so it remaines centered as it spins with the screw in the outdrive bore. then the thrust bearing. then the washer with the larger ID goes on. the larger hole is so it does not rub on the screw as it spins the oposit direction of the screw.Also it may have a larger OD so it is centered in the out drive bore that it spins with. were as the smaller washer needs clearance in the bore so it does not rub as it spins oposit of the outdrive. Make sence?
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Old 11-10-2011, 02:55 PM   #1742
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Ok I don't have the parts sitting in front of me but this is how it should be. The washer with the smaller ID goes on the screw first. The smaller hole should be somewhat snug on the screw so it remaines centered as it spins with the screw in the outdrive bore. then the thrust bearing. then the washer with the larger ID goes on. the larger hole is so it does not rub on the screw as it spins the oposit direction of the screw.Also it may have a larger OD so it is centered in the out drive bore that it spins with. were as the smaller washer needs clearance in the bore so it does not rub as it spins oposit of the outdrive. Make sence?
I dont think they have different internal diameters.
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Old 11-10-2011, 03:01 PM   #1743
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I dont think they have different internal diameters.
Don't think, Check. Even IF they did'nt the outer would still apply.
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Old 11-10-2011, 03:10 PM   #1744
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Don't think, Check
Since you "know" that they are in fact different, please post the difference in internal diameters please.
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Old 11-10-2011, 03:12 PM   #1745
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OK, so having run the car for a few weeks now, here are some observations, recommendations and findings.
The car went together great, almost no hand fitting(unlike the 22), but was missing a lower shock cap. I built the car rm4 as I like a lot of rear grip.

First couple nights out with the car went very badly, multiple ball cups popping off, broken steering link, and broken rear shock tower. I replaced the ball cups with jconcepts, and used associated ball studs, problem fixed.

I glued the steering link back together and used it as a template to make one out of carbon fiber. broke that one too. Made another one out of 2 sheets of thin c/f and broke that too. Went to home depot, bought some aluminum and made one out of that. Works perfect, but stripped a servo horn. Got a TLR 22 aluminum servo horn because it is extremely close to the offset and length of the rango one. So far so good but I would like to use a good servo saver if I can find one.

Kit diff balls or rings got very notchy very quick, so I got some b-fast balls and flipped the rings and is now butter smooth. Trick is to not let the diff ever slip. When first adjusting, make sure diff is tight(1/4 turn backed off from locked) and slipper is loose. Do your bench testing of the slipper and slowly tighten it down making sure the slipper will slip before the diff will bark.

Tlr 22 front wheel bolts will work with stock wheels, but not with DE rims.

You can replace all the screws that go straight down from the rr bulkhead to the chassis side plates with 5-40 screws because the 3mm screws dont tighten down.

I am no longer running any down stop screws, as the problems they cause are greater than any gains from ease of adjustability.
I put 4mm limiters in both front and rear shocks and have total shock lengths of 69mm front and 107mm rear. I simply adjust the lower eyelets up or down a little to adjust droop.

If you break a rear suspension arm, you can use one from a DEX410 with a lot of dremeling.(don't ask me how I know this haha).

That's all I can think of for now, hope it helps someone. I love driving this car, it does everything so well. Traction, steering, stability, it has it all.

Last edited by patrick; 11-10-2011 at 06:13 PM.
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Old 11-10-2011, 03:54 PM   #1746
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I get what he meant by this..... the washers were a different DIAMETER, not thickness. If you put the bigger of the two washers in first, then the smaller diameter washer would push against the snap ring, but more towards the middle of the ring as opposed to out towards the outer edge where the ring enters the groove of the outdrive..the theory is that as pressure is applied to the thrust assembly, the smaller washer could make the snap ring flex enough that it could dislodge it from the groove. If the larger washer is pushing against the snap ring, then the pressure is applied closer to the "solid" part, where the ring rests in the groove of the outdrive. Little to no flex of the ring means, it shouldnt pop out of the groove.
Now that makes perfect sense. Thanks for clearing it up- I thought he was referring to thickness, not outside diameter.
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Old 11-10-2011, 04:05 PM   #1747
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Originally Posted by hopsing View Post
I get what he meant by this..... the washers were a different DIAMETER, not thickness. If you put the bigger of the two washers in first, then the smaller diameter washer would push against the snap ring, but more towards the middle of the ring as opposed to out towards the outer edge where the ring enters the groove of the outdrive..the theory is that as pressure is applied to the thrust assembly, the smaller washer could make the snap ring flex enough that it could dislodge it from the groove. If the larger washer is pushing against the snap ring, then the pressure is applied closer to the "solid" part, where the ring rests in the groove of the outdrive. Little to no flex of the ring means, it shouldnt pop out of the groove.
EXACTLY!! Thanks, I couldnt have explained it any better myself..
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Old 11-10-2011, 04:36 PM   #1748
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Since you "know" that they are in fact different, please post the difference in internal diameters please.
As I said, I don't have the parts in front of me to measure & since my diff has been butter smooth with now failier since day one I don't plan on taking it apart anytime soon. Maybe someone who is having trouble can measure theres & tell me i'm wrong.
The only thing I am 100% sure of is no manufacturer is going to go to the expence & trouble of 2 different washers if it didn't matter how they went.
I do however have a spare schumacher thrust "same design" small measures 3.40 large measures 3.45

Last edited by Olscool; 11-10-2011 at 04:48 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 11-10-2011, 04:38 PM   #1749
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Since you "know" that they are in fact different, please post the difference in internal diameters please.
They do have different ID between two washers, smaller goes first, then bearing, then bigger ID. If they go wrong , the diff performance effected.
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Old 11-10-2011, 04:50 PM   #1750
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They do have different ID between two washers, smaller goes first, then bearing, then bigger ID. If they go wrong , the diff performance effected.
THANK YOU
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Old 11-10-2011, 07:22 PM   #1751
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Glad I'm not the only one missing the lower shock cap and also break the rear shock tower.


Quote:
Originally Posted by patrick View Post
OK, so having run the car for a few weeks now, here are some observations, recommendations and findings.
The car went together great, almost no hand fitting(unlike the 22), but was missing a lower shock cap. I built the car rm4 as I like a lot of rear grip.

First couple nights out with the car went very badly, multiple ball cups popping off, broken steering link, and broken rear shock tower. I replaced the ball cups with jconcepts, and used associated ball studs, problem fixed.

I glued the steering link back together and used it as a template to make one out of carbon fiber. broke that one too. Made another one out of 2 sheets of thin c/f and broke that too. Went to home depot, bought some aluminum and made one out of that. Works perfect, but stripped a servo horn. Got a TLR 22 aluminum servo horn because it is extremely close to the offset and length of the rango one. So far so good but I would like to use a good servo saver if I can find one.

Kit diff balls or rings got very notchy very quick, so I got some b-fast balls and flipped the rings and is now butter smooth. Trick is to not let the diff ever slip. When first adjusting, make sure diff is tight(1/4 turn backed off from locked) and slipper is loose. Do your bench testing of the slipper and slowly tighten it down making sure the slipper will slip before the diff will bark.

Tlr 22 front wheel bolts will work with stock wheels, but not with DE rims.

You can replace all the screws that go straight down from the rr bulkhead to the chassis side plates with 5-40 screws because the 3mm screws dont tighten down.

I am no longer running any down stop screws, as the problems they cause are greater than any gains from ease of adjustability.
I put 4mm limiters in both front and rear shocks and have total shock lengths of 69mm front and 107mm rear. I simply adjust the lower eyelets up or down a little to adjust droop.

If you break a rear suspension arm, you can use one from a DEX410 with a lot of dremeling.(don't ask me how I know this haha).

That's all I can think of for now, hope it helps someone. I love driving this car, it does everything so well. Traction, steering, stability, it has it all.
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Old 11-10-2011, 07:38 PM   #1752
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Patrick has been laying down some great laps with the car! Must be the tire sauce...
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Old 11-10-2011, 08:34 PM   #1753
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Can someone tell me what the internal ratio is on this car, RM?
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:31 PM   #1754
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2.6. rm and mm 3 and 4 gear is all 2.6 as the idlers play no part in fdr.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:46 PM   #1755
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So, I don't have calipers accurate enough to measure the internal and external diameteres of the thrust washers, but all you have to do is put them on at the same time and feel the play between the size of the bolt, and the internal hole to tell that one washer is plum flush with the bolt, and the other one is just so slightly larger with some play. Also, it seems that the larger internal diameter washer, also has a slightly larger outer diameter as well.. but without super accurate gauges, I can't confirm it.
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