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Old 01-25-2016, 09:18 AM   #17101
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I haven't tried that on my Dex210 v2 but il tell you this on my B5M with the battery side to side it makes a big difrence with grip and especially stable easy to drive harder on Meduim grip .

So this buggy will benfit from it for sure .
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Old 01-25-2016, 09:46 AM   #17102
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yeah that is what I noticed too.

So, can someone common with me running the motor the wrong way apparently in a 3 gear setup, what will I notice that is different exactly handling wise?
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Old 01-25-2016, 10:02 AM   #17103
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More on power steering you an push it harder pending on grip level, jumps level, corners flatter just feels more neutral . Drivetrain is much more freeer .
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Old 01-25-2016, 10:07 AM   #17104
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yeah that is what I noticed too.

So, can someone common with me running the motor the wrong way apparently in a 3 gear setup, what will I notice that is different exactly handling wise?
If you have the motor mounted on the left side but only have the gearbox setup for 3 gear, you'll floor it and immediately go backwards so get that fixed! Otherwise you'll have to reverse the motor rotation and it'll still be rotating backwards in relation to the wheels. Just fix it.

In my opinion, if you are used to driving 3 gear rear motor, 3 gear mid motor isn't much different. They handle very much the same but with a different weight balance. It's very neutral. It's 4 gear mid motor where everything goes to hell. You get on the throttle hard and the front end unloads and your front wheels are along for the ride. Get on the brakes hard and weight tries to shift forward, unloading the back causing you to slide out easier on corner entry. 4 gear mm is just all around crap in my opinion. 3 gear mid or 3 gear rear motor depending on track conditions are the way to go. 4 gear is an abomination that was created due to a lack of understanding of static weight based on traction requirements. But hey, you can easily do back flips mid air and we all know that style points alone win races!

The way I'm really interested in is the 210F motor orientation. I though the Team C TM2 was brilliant for this. Take artificial weight shift due to motor rotation out of the equation entirely and just utilize weight balance for grip. That car should drive about as neutral and predictably as is possible.
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Old 01-25-2016, 11:26 AM   #17105
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If you have the motor mounted on the left side but only have the gearbox setup for 3 gear, you'll floor it and immediately go backwards so get that fixed! Otherwise you'll have to reverse the motor rotation and it'll still be rotating backwards in relation to the wheels. Just fix it.

In my opinion, if you are used to driving 3 gear rear motor, 3 gear mid motor isn't much different. They handle very much the same but with a different weight balance. It's very neutral. It's 4 gear mid motor where everything goes to hell. You get on the throttle hard and the front end unloads and your front wheels are along for the ride. Get on the brakes hard and weight tries to shift forward, unloading the back causing you to slide out easier on corner entry. 4 gear mm is just all around crap in my opinion. 3 gear mid or 3 gear rear motor depending on track conditions are the way to go. 4 gear is an abomination that was created due to a lack of understanding of static weight based on traction requirements. But hey, you can easily do back flips mid air and we all know that style points alone win races!

The way I'm really interested in is the 210F motor orientation. I though the Team C TM2 was brilliant for this. Take artificial weight shift due to motor rotation out of the equation entirely and just utilize weight balance for grip. That car should drive about as neutral and predictably as is possible.



You are right about 4 gear mid motor it does all them things don't care for it pretty soon im going to 3 gear mid motor on my B5M . Even on this buggy I liked 3 gear more .
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Old 01-25-2016, 12:29 PM   #17106
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Originally Posted by tc5 man View Post
More on power steering you an push it harder pending on grip level, jumps level, corners flatter just feels more neutral . Drivetrain is much more freeer .
thanks. So basically getting the motor oriented correctly will do this in comparison to what I have going on now, and the wrong way oriented I see less of this described.

All in all the car worked excellent, I wouldn't mind more on power steering though but its nothing I was fighting for. Could turn with the best of them out there, car was effortless to drive.

Is there a particular wheel you guys recommend over others that work on the exotek hexes?


fredswain: Do you think it would be possible to run the dex210F for dirt conditions, if so, what changes would you do?
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Old 01-25-2016, 01:07 PM   #17107
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fredswain: Do you think it would be possible to run the dex210F for dirt conditions, if so, what changes would you do?
I personally think so. It all comes down to weight on the drive wheels. The slipperier the conditions get, the more weight you want on the rear. The real question is when is too much weight too much? I generally ran MM3 on my car when possible on our old outdoor dirt track but I found one particular layout where MM4 was better. Then I just switched to RM3 and all was right in the world again. I suspect the 210F will be something like this. It'll work as long as you can get rear grip. Our outdoor track is long gone but our indoor track is very high grip. People run MM3, slicks, and some still push a battery all the way forward. The 210F would work well here.
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Old 01-25-2016, 01:32 PM   #17108
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thanks, I got the extremes of outdoor dirt and indoor carpet. I think the plan b chassis I have will handle both conditions in a MM configuration but I like the looks of the new dex210F lol.
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Old 01-25-2016, 01:43 PM   #17109
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What turned me off to the Paln B chassis is that it's just too long. I can't think of any scenario where +11 is a length I'd want. I run my rear hubs all the way back so with a +8 chassis, it's already plenty long and I've currently got the V1 chassis on it which is the shortest.
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Old 01-25-2016, 03:17 PM   #17110
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Originally Posted by fredswain View Post
What turned me off to the Paln B chassis is that it's just too long. I can't think of any scenario where +11 is a length I'd want. I run my rear hubs all the way back so with a +8 chassis, it's already plenty long and I've currently got the V1 chassis on it which is the shortest.
I thought about that but have been happy with how it performed, vehicle turned on a dime on carpet so have been happy. Who knows, maybe I'll spring for a short chassis if he will make it and see how it goes.

Right now, still looking at the F vehicle
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Old 01-26-2016, 07:18 AM   #17111
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So I have this used Durango DEX210 v1 that I just put together. And I'm seeing all these YT videos about temps: ESC, motor, and battery. Says that the motor loves to be around 150*F, the ESC about 140, and the battery can be up to 140 and all is safe (at least that's what I remember).

The deets:
Fantom Racing Ion3 13.5 turn motor
Viper VTX10R-Black set in blinky mode
Running mid motor 3
stock 87 tooth spur and 25 tooth pinion (ratio of 3.48:1)
SPC LiPo pack 5000mAh 40C 2s
Shumacher mini pins on 60mm wheel
Duratrax infrared temp sensor.

So I ran my car yesterday in the cul-de-sac to see how hot my setup got in 5 minutes. Ran full throttle as much as I could in the limited distance I was dealing with. Outside temp was about 58*F, and the motor and ESC never went above 64.

Does this mean that I'm running very safe ratios, and the car can stand more? Like a 28 or 29 tooth pinion? Car was plenty fast for me, but I can always take more speed .

Am I overthinking this? I have seen that motors love to run around 150*F but anything under that is OK, right? Or does it really need to be that warm? What's wrong if it's too cool?
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Old 01-26-2016, 08:17 AM   #17112
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Originally Posted by emerilnut View Post
So I have this used Durango DEX210 v1 that I just put together. And I'm seeing all these YT videos about temps: ESC, motor, and battery. Says that the motor loves to be around 150*F, the ESC about 140, and the battery can be up to 140 and all is safe (at least that's what I remember).

The deets:
Fantom Racing Ion3 13.5 turn motor
Viper VTX10R-Black set in blinky mode
Running mid motor 3
stock 87 tooth spur and 25 tooth pinion (ratio of 3.48:1)
SPC LiPo pack 5000mAh 40C 2s
Shumacher mini pins on 60mm wheel
Duratrax infrared temp sensor.

So I ran my car yesterday in the cul-de-sac to see how hot my setup got in 5 minutes. Ran full throttle as much as I could in the limited distance I was dealing with. Outside temp was about 58*F, and the motor and ESC never went above 64.

Does this mean that I'm running very safe ratios, and the car can stand more? Like a 28 or 29 tooth pinion? Car was plenty fast for me, but I can always take more speed .

Am I overthinking this? I have seen that motors love to run around 150*F but anything under that is OK, right? Or does it really need to be that warm? What's wrong if it's too cool?
I'm sure that your fine where you are if your not going to race the car. If you are it may be painfully under geared for a 13.5 class and she may be slow against the other cars. I think I used to run a 72/28 gear combo when I was running the 13.5 class.

For temps I usually see about 155 on my motors, 110 on my esc and about 100 on my battery. This is running Mod on carpet for 5 minutes. I know when we first switched to carpet, my battery would see 115 to 120 and that's when you start to puff batteries in my experience. I went through 1 shorty and 1 set of saddles. Anyway, my advice isn't gospel, just what I've seen in the past.
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Old 01-26-2016, 08:25 AM   #17113
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for blinky mode running once I settle on a timing setting on the motor, I usually use the gear for the longest straight method and adjust from there based on temps.

Basically as it was told to me by the late great Big Jim, one of the premier motor guys before his passing is that you gear your vehicle to top out towards the end of the longest straight. And then make adjustments based on temps and feel of the vehicle.

I have been using this method and find that in general, i really don't adjust my gearing much at all afterwards.

Did you get any other spur gears with your vehicle? For some reason on a 13.5T motor 87 tooth size high to me.
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Old 01-26-2016, 08:26 AM   #17114
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You'll never hurt your electronics by running them cool. The problem with people gearing solely around temps is that it may not be the fastest way around the track. I gear for max performance around the track while staying within a safe temp range. If the motor and esc run cool, that's a bonus.
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Old 01-26-2016, 08:48 AM   #17115
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Thanks, guys. I was sure I was just fine if everything was cooler, but wasn't sure if I was sapping performance running cooler than desired.

Quote:
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Did you get any other spur gears with your vehicle? For some reason on a 13.5T motor 87 tooth size high to me.
There were a couple of others in there. I didn't really focus on them since I was focused on the rebuild. I'll give them a look and start playing with gearing to see how fast this thing can go since I seem to have plenty of room with temperature.
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