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Old 08-18-2015, 08:14 AM   #16411
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I'm not going to disagree on chassis type. I've been playing with composite chassis for a while and happen to love them. However, I always go for super stiff reinforcement. I don't believe in chassis flex except in the loosest and roughest of tracks like old loamy tracks. Try the shock setup. I let the suspension do it's job and the chassis do the job of connecting them together as tightly as possible. Why let the chassis do work that the suspension should be doing?
I just feel like the car is well balanced now... I tried the Kyosho and B5m and dropped to mid B mains.... Back to Durango and mid A. I think we can agree no other car drives like the 210... Unfortunately people are hesitate to try something different in my area. Pillars from Kyosho/Orion use to live 25 minutes away so there's a strong Kyosho following here with at least 4-5 sponsored drivers local and Phend lives opposite side of the state so strong Losi following here.
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Old 08-18-2015, 09:18 AM   #16412
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Several tried the 210 here and didn't like it. It's my opinion that it's because of the shock issue. On high grip tracks where you run a low ride height, there just isn't much travel left in the shocks for the car to roll in corners. When it hits the stops, the car washes out. High grip is where you want a stiff chassis so going to a less stiff chassis to gain grip is a bandaid solution to attempt to offset the real issue. I think if people here would have figured this out, rather than just giving up and moving on, the car would have a far better reputation.
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Old 08-18-2015, 06:04 PM   #16413
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Several tried the 210 here and didn't like it. It's my opinion that it's because of the shock issue. On high grip tracks where you run a low ride height, there just isn't much travel left in the shocks for the car to roll in corners. When it hits the stops, the car washes out. High grip is where you want a stiff chassis so going to a less stiff chassis to gain grip is a bandaid solution to attempt to offset the real issue. I think if people here would have figured this out, rather than just giving up and moving on, the car would have a far better reputation.
To help with the short shock issue I found on the v2 you really don't need those thick up travel liminiters. I stroked the piston up with the lower spring retainer on the shaft and the piston was pretty flush with the top of the body. I do use old o-ring seals for upward limiters to be on the safe side but I have gained a good 4mm upward travel doing so.
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Old 08-18-2015, 09:40 PM   #16414
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I removed my V2 towers and have them sitting in a box. I hated the changes. They limit the suspension up travel which unfortunately doesn't allow the car to roll very far in corners. This causes the car to wash out. I run the V1 rear suspension but up front I run the V2 rear shocks with white series springs with the DESC210 front tower and V2 front arms. This setup allows for more suspension uptravel and drastically transforms the car in turns on high grip tracks. On hard clay it's like a different car in the corners.
Hi Fred,

Could you please explane to me, why you would like the car to roll that much?
Is it because weight transfer to the outside weels in corners, to get more grip to the outside?

I always thought, it is better to have a car, that does roll as less as possible!

Thx in advance
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Old 08-19-2015, 08:12 AM   #16415
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To help with the short shock issue I found on the v2 you really don't need those thick up travel liminiters. I stroked the piston up with the lower spring retainer on the shaft and the piston was pretty flush with the top of the body. I do use old o-ring seals for upward limiters to be on the safe side but I have gained a good 4mm upward travel doing so.
At the back end, why go to all that trouble at all? Just leave the V1 rear tower and shocks on it. It's perfect. The V2 screwed up the rear. The V2 front end only shortened the front shocks because the straight arms mount the bottom of the shock higher up. However, even removing the limiters doesn't give enough travel. A longer shock is needed. The 210 copied the suspension geometry of the B4. However the AE shocks aren't as long in assembly as the Durango shocks. I run the bump stops because I only run bladder shocks. I saw the light a couple of years ago and now refuse to ever run emulsion ever again. I need room for the bladder. The piston should never touch it at full compression.

I also look for a certain shock angle at max shock compression. I want the shock to be exactly perpendicular to the arm at full compression. That's the point where the spring has the most leverage on the arm and it's most important at max suspension compression. In order to get both that and the necessary shock length, I needed to run the V2 rear shock assembly up front with the DESC front tower and V2 arms. To get the appropriate spring rates, I had to use the white series rears up front. At the rear I just kept the V1 shocks and tower. The rear arms can be V1 or V2. They don't change geometry.


I did this because I wanted to correct what I believe to be a fundamental geometry problem of the car. I'm not content with tuning solutions that seek to attempt to offset or cancel out a problem. I'd rather just eliminate the actual problem. I don't like chassis flex so using flex to do the job of the suspension was never an option. You don't need chassis flex. You want it to be as rigid as possible. If you need flex, you've either got a tuning problem or a fundamental design flaw somewhere and flex is a band-aid to offset it. If the suspension is bottoming in corners and the car washes out, why would I want to allow the chassis to flex to give some compliance that the suspension can't when I can just fix the suspension? That flex hurts in other places. Removing bump stops doesn't allow bladders to be used so that limits things to emulsion only. I am hugely against emulsion under any situation so why would I want to do that?

Fix the problems. Don't degrade something else just to offset a problem.
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Old 08-19-2015, 10:15 AM   #16416
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You're way to deep man..thinking way too much. What's the ratings on the white series? Rears up front? I watched Travis Amezcua at Crcrc winter champ race in January... Nice guy if you have a chance to meet him. His car was insane...he shared his set up with me. I tweaked a few things and it's amazing on medium to high bite. No funky setup stuff... Only thing I switched to the CF chassis for wt.... But the added flex = traction. Plus if you're back end is loose check the diff....ball diff anything other than the stock one....b-fast is best. Been running this car for year, actually raced on the team for a year until kids.... Its very confusing when you make this car seem so difficult..especially for those making a decision on a purchase.
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Old 08-19-2015, 10:24 AM   #16417
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You're way to deep man..thinking way too much. What's the ratings on the white series? Rears up front? I watched Travis Amezcua at Crcrc winter champ race in January... Nice guy if you have a chance to meet him. His car was insane...he shared his set up with me. I tweaked a few things and it's amazing on medium to high bite. No funky setup stuff... Only thing I switched to the CF chassis for wt.... But the added flex = traction. Plus if you're back end is loose check the diff....ball diff anything other than the stock one....b-fast is best. Been running this car for year, actually raced on the team for a year until kids.... Its very confusing when you make this car seem so difficult..especially for those making a decision on a purchase.
My buddy and his son have been to two or three races in the last few months where Amezcua was racing the Dingo and he said he is very fast but the car he saw isn't very stock. He also like you said he is a very nice guy and was a pleasure to talk with.

I'm thinking of picking up a V2 buggy as I still have two of the originals but like the updates they have done on the Durango as honestly my biggest bitch was it was far more time consuming of a car to work on than any other brand I have run in the last few years, well the back end was. On a good note I never broke a part in the year I raced it and then my buddy as a bigger ran the 2nd year on my car in stock buggy and while learning he only ever broke a ball cup. I did switch him to the gear diff but that was intentional and in stock worked great for him. Now I'm thinking of picking up a new one since I work at a hobby shop I can order parts when ever I need them. Will still keep my B5m as it is dialed but if get a Durango and get a setup that works as good as my B5 I would have no problems selling it and just having the Dingo.
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Old 08-19-2015, 10:48 AM   #16418
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He runs some mods I'm sure but the set is a good starting point. Pm me your email and I'll see if can forward you the set up...... What kind surface you race on?
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:59 AM   #16419
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He runs some mods I'm sure but the set is a good starting point. Pm me your email and I'll see if can forward you the set up...... What kind surface you race on?
We run on indoor clay here in Pa at a place called Bumps and Jumps. I would be interested in getting an idea on what type of setup he is running. Never hurts to have options to compare stuff with.
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Old 08-19-2015, 12:56 PM   #16420
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Hope you can see...if not I could text. I run battery all the way back(shorty) no weight, Ackerman all the way back and 3.5 rear toe. Been a winner for me. No limiters in the shocks with full droop, ends turned all the way in. I liked the 3 hole 1.6 up front but 1.7 2 hole with 32.5 I liked better.....using blue AE springs front and White rears
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:27 PM   #16421
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Shoot...that's RM...let me see if I can locate...the MM one...sorry
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:31 PM   #16422
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That's better
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Old 08-19-2015, 04:19 PM   #16423
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That's better
Thanks Kerby. I checked them all out.
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Old 08-19-2015, 07:02 PM   #16424
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I would also like to say thanks for posting those setups.
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Old 08-19-2015, 09:45 PM   #16425
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Gee, I was just trying to help. You really don't need those external limiters. I'm running my v2 in mm 3 gear configuration and don't have a problem with the v2 suspension geo. if you are doing all that stuff like putting rear shocks on the front and mixing shock towers then maybe you should just try a different brand.
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