R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric Off-Road

Like Tree33Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-03-2015, 01:31 PM   #15886
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 800
Trader Rating: 21 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tdub77 View Post
Actually I wanted to try a b fast but they don't make one for the 210 but they do make one for the b5. My diff is holding up fine but the c clip does suck and I would rather not have to deal with it

Tim
They absolutely do, just ordered 2
__________________
AE B6
AE B64
kerby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:06 PM   #15887
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kerby View Post
They absolutely do, just ordered 2
Thanks Kerby, I did contact them and they do have one. I could not find it listed on their page that is why I didnt think they had one.

Do you still use the durango outdrives with the b fast diff?
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:07 PM   #15888
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Does anyone know how much longer a dest210 chassis is compared to a dex210 +8 chassis

Thanks

Tim
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:18 PM   #15889
Tech Prophet
 
tc5 man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: levittown pa
Posts: 16,893
Default

B fast does have the diff balls for the Durango but i wish they have a complete diff . Me personally cant stand that dumb C- clip.
__________________
Losi SCTE 4x4, Tekno SC410 4X4 SC, Associated T4.1, Hitec 7954sh, mamba monster 2200kv, airtronics MX-3 X. Losi SCTE 4x4, Tekno SC410 4X4 SC, Associated T4.1, Mugen MBX6 ECO .

Hobby Hut offroad, Mushroom bowl offroad, Fun Center raceway.
GS HOBBY , Stormer Hobbies, Amain Hobbies, RRP Hobby .
tc5 man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:41 PM   #15890
ekt
Tech Master
 
ekt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Burnie, Australia
Posts: 1,228
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tdub77 View Post
Does anyone know how much longer a dest210 chassis is compared to a dex210 +8 chassis

Thanks

Tim
The DEST210 chassis is 16mm longer than the +8.
__________________
Leo Lorenzen
Xray Australia - Proline Australia - GForce Australia - Fantom Australia - Hearns Hobbies
ekt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:42 PM   #15891
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tc5 man View Post
B fast does have the diff balls for the Durango but i wish they have a complete diff . Me personally cant stand that dumb C- clip.
Im with ya about the c clip!! That is why I was wondering if a b5 diff would fit...it would all come down to if the outdrives would fit the durango drive shafts. The rest of it would fit I think. I know a guy at the track who put a b4 gear diff in his b5 and I also think i remember people who use to run the durango diff in their b4's. So with all of that I would think the diffs are the same size to physically fit, I'm just not sure if the outdrives to drive shafts will fit.

Tim
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 04:48 PM   #15892
Tech Prophet
 
tc5 man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: levittown pa
Posts: 16,893
Default

Actually does the B4.1 ball diff work for this buggy the Type B transmission case or a B5 ball diff ? The outdrives to .
__________________
Losi SCTE 4x4, Tekno SC410 4X4 SC, Associated T4.1, Hitec 7954sh, mamba monster 2200kv, airtronics MX-3 X. Losi SCTE 4x4, Tekno SC410 4X4 SC, Associated T4.1, Mugen MBX6 ECO .

Hobby Hut offroad, Mushroom bowl offroad, Fun Center raceway.
GS HOBBY , Stormer Hobbies, Amain Hobbies, RRP Hobby .
tc5 man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 06:03 PM   #15893
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fredswain View Post
Yup. That's solely from a lack of weight on the rear wheels.
So how much weight do you generally use on the rear for a med to med/high bite clay, mm3 that is. Also do you put the weight as far back in the chassis (still in front of rear suspension) as you can?

Tim
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 06:56 PM   #15894
Tech Elite
 
rcjunky1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 2,185
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

I'm pretty sure the b4 diff with Durango diff gear works with shims for side to side play. I've almost done it and might once my diff needs a rebuild using the MIP super diff for the b4 with the Durango diff fear and 3mm diff balls
__________________
Official distributor of Dan-O-Mite Custom Parts- Durango 210 RF pivot blocks
Andrew Butters' Burghgraef
Team Durango Canada
Great Hobbies, Hobbico, Skyrc, Exotek
rcjunky1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 10:05 PM   #15895
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

..
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2015, 03:06 PM   #15896
Tech Legend
 
Cain's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: West Fargo, North Dakota
Posts: 29,078
Trader Rating: 235 (100%+)
Default

got in some track time with the dex210 vehicle I have here. it has a variety of upgrades but whatever turnbuckles were used in the rear were garbage. So looking for whatever replaced the ones i have on my vehicle in the front.

they are dark gray in color and the previous owner went with a ball stud and ball cup setup that isn't a direct pass through like the durangos, these won't come off.

So any ideas on that let me know. I'll post pics later.

Anyway, so ran carpet onroad with my dex210 and once I figured out the tire situation, which was clay slicks it worked excellent, even though I am using the plastic dime chassis.

I do want to tune more, the slipper I need to lock up I am thinking for more punch, also, trying to decide on some springs.

Do the AE springs fit the durango shocks fine or is it better to stick with durango springs?

Also, I do have the avid setup here, but if there is a slipper eliminator that works with the stock spurs I am all ears.

lastly, I used the 4 gear mid setup, adn one of thing things I was fighting before changing tires was off power hook in turns. It seemed to really want come around as soon as you let off.

now, the tires appeared to fix it, but I am wondering if a 3 gear setup would have been easier to drive in general?


On turnbuckles, looking at the lunsford kit it appears it just uses 50mm turnbuckles all around with there ball cups.

My ball studs measure at 4.8mm so I am thinking using the 50mm turnbuckles and the ones that look longer (ball cups) just cut down or fine some cups in my part bin that are shorter.
__________________
Member - Red River Radio/Control Car Club
< Tekno SCT410.3 x 2 |HB Racing D413 x 2 | Tekno EB48SL | Yokomo YZ-2 DTM x 2>

Last edited by Cain; 02-05-2015 at 09:17 PM.
Cain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2015, 06:30 PM   #15897
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 390
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fredswain View Post
Dino, how many times are you going to keep saying that? You are 175,000% WRONG!
4 gear always behaves like 4 gear in MM or RM. 3 gear always behaves like 3 gear in MM or RM. 4 gear ALWAYS transfers more weight. 3 gear ALWAYs feels more neutral. RM or MM is 100% irrelevant!!!
How many more times do I have to repeat this???????????
Surely its what dino said, if you have it in rm3 for example and just spin the gearbox around and use mm3, you are putting the motor on the other side, mm4 and rm3 have more weight transfer, and mm3 and rm4 are more neutral with less weight transfer (according to the original 210 page on the TD site).
__________________
Team Durango - DNX8 - DEX8 - DEX410v4 - DEX210v2 - Alpha Lutz WE - VP PRO - Futaba - Hudy - Orion
av4625 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2015, 07:38 PM   #15898
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 174
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by av4625 View Post
Surely its what dino said, if you have it in rm3 for example and just spin the gearbox around and use mm3, you are putting the motor on the other side, mm4 and rm3 have more weight transfer, and mm3 and rm4 are more neutral with less weight transfer (according to the original 210 page on the TD site).
http://www.team-durango.com/in-the-p...rticle_id=4472

You should look at the differences between mm3 and rm 3. The motor is physically on the same side of the vehicle. Because the motor is on the same side the motor IS NOT on the same side of the gear box when comparing mm3 to rm3. In 3 gear the endbell will be facing the drivers side of the car with the pinion on the passenger side. In 4 gear the endbell will be on the passenger side with the pinion on the drivers side. It DOES NOT MATTER if it is built mm or rm. When looking at 3 gear the rotation of the motor is in the same direction, toward the rear of the car, same direction the wheels would turn if they are turning in reverse.

Someone smart once said that every action has an opposite and equal reaction. So what does that mean? If the motor is spinning in the same direction as the wheels in reverse, something that is holding it (the motor mount) has a force on it that is opposite and equal to the torque that the motor has. This force is applied to the front of the motor, no matter if its mm or rm.

In rm3 the force is applied to the rear axles because the rear axles are in front of the motor. In mm3 the force is applied to the area in front of the motor. The rear of the car will still squat, but not as much as rm3 will make it squat. This is because rm3 has more leverage than mm3 because of the placement of the force on the chassis. The force is applied to a point that is further towards the rear of the chassis.

Picture this, put you finger on the rear axle and push down, now push with the same force two inches in front of the rear axle. In which spot did the rear suspension compress more? Obviously it did when you pushed on the rear axle, because of the leverage that you had on the chassis.

Now the same is true with 4 gear. In 4 gear the rotation of the motor is in the same direction as the wheels going forward no matter if it is mm4 or rm4. Now because the motor is rotating forward the force is to the rear of the motor. So in rm 4 the force will be at the rear of the car. This will have more leverage on the car than any other configuration simply because of the location of the motor. In mm4 the force will be applied to almost the same spot that rm3 applies it but because of the direction of the rotation of the motor the force will be greater than the force made by rm3.

It has taken me a while to figure this all out and sometimes it is hard because of all the hearsay on the subject and also because of racers having to be pc for the companies they collect money from.

Hope this helps

Tim
Tdub77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2015, 08:38 AM   #15899
Tech Master
 
13Maschine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,554
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via Skype™ to 13Maschine
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by fredswain View Post
Dino, how many times are you going to keep saying that? You are 175,000% WRONG!
4 gear always behaves like 4 gear in MM or RM. 3 gear always behaves like 3 gear in MM or RM. 4 gear ALWAYS transfers more weight. 3 gear ALWAYs feels more neutral. RM or MM is 100% irrelevant!!!
How many more times do I have to repeat this???????????
It seems many times the explanations have been extremely oversimplified.

Fred you have a lot of great knowledge however in this case I think something is missing. Inertia follows rotational direction not number of gears. Number of gears changes the direction of rotation, this is the critical factor. You have two large masses that can either rotate in concert or in opposition. The motor and the transmission+wheels. Take all the RM/MM/3gears/4gear…. BS away and simply look at mass and direction of rotation. How many spinning masses do you have and how heavy are they. Are they all spinning and more importantly accelerating in the same direction? Same calculation for any kind of inertia. F = mA. Notice that Dino also mentions motor rotation as it is possible to reverse the direction at the ESC level. This means the usual ideas are further complicated.

You will have almost zero control on the air over the attitude of the car (front to back) with a neutral setup like standard MM3/RM4. When I say neutral I mean when the motor and transmission inertias are canceling their respective energies. Sometimes this is ok. Especially if you aren't dealing with a lot of jumps.

This is easily tested. Take you car and hold it in your hand fully ready to go. Hold the car in the middle under the chassis so you are free of the wheels. Give it some throttle, the car should shift it's weight to the rear and rotate the front wheels up. Now give it full brake. The front wheels should go down opposite of what happens with throttle. This is essentially what happens on the track and in the air over jumps especially. This effect is greatly reduced with a more neutral orientation of motor and transmission.

I'm glad to see this discussion fleshed out even more, I hope we can all be nice and try to learn from each other

REMEMBER YOU DO NOT FULLY UNDERSTAND A CONCEPT UNLESS YOU CAN EFFECTIVELY SHARE IT!
__________________
SoCal R/C Privateer, find me at either OCRC or SCVRC!
My JUNSI POWERED Rides: Xray XB2 CE, Hot Bodies D413, Kyosho RB6, HobbyWing Xerun 3.1, Futaba 4PX, Futaba and MKS Servos, Speed Passion Hirosaka and HW V10 Powerplants!
First car Kyosho Pegasus and RC10CE! More than 25 years Racing! Happy to lend a helping hand. Just ask! :)

Last edited by 13Maschine; 02-07-2015 at 09:00 AM.
13Maschine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2015, 10:46 AM   #15900
Tech Addict
 
71schaeffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kansas city, MO
Posts: 559
Trader Rating: 8 (90%+)
Default

How would you convert the v1 rear shock tower so you can the shocks in the rear? I just got the v1 today and im really excited about it! Idk were to start shock wise and stuff. Im running on an indoor clay track thats somewhat loose
71schaeffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
St Ives RC Club B4Bandit Australian Racing 16572 10-14-2017 01:35 AM
EPMTs check in here. (a subsidiary of TNT) overtki11 Singapore R/C Racers 55470 05-07-2017 11:57 PM
Team Durango DEX410 ASH93A Australian Racing 925 04-08-2013 09:51 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (1 members and 1 guests)
coaltrain
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 06:37 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net