I really hope AE and Losi are just waiting for the lipo dust to settle before they come out with 1/8 buggies specifically designed for electric. Regardless, I'm starting to see an electric RC8 in my near future! It would be so fun to race 1/10 on a nice indoor track during the winter and 1/8 on a big nitro track during the summer.
You obviously don't know very much about these lipo cells. If you will take a look around this forum consensus will show you that they are the way to go. A123 cells are another option, but they do weigh a considerable bit more, however they are much safer and can be charged faster. Here goes a run down on a lipo battery pack.
The packs are made up of xk mah 3.7 volt cells. Most cells are 2k mah. These cells have a C rating which determines how many amps can go through the cell per Ah in the total pack. For example, a 10c 8kmah(8ah-mah stands for mili amps) can be discharged at an 80 amp continuous rate.
Now, you ask how do you achieve these high voltages and high capacity with 2k mah 3.7 volt cells.
If you want more capacity then you wire them in parralel. If you want more voltage then you wire them in series. When some one runs two separate batteries they are simply running a hump pack. The lipo packs which you can purchase are pre-assembled because most people buying them apearently don't like to sauder. Not to mention there is not a matching system for these batteries since you never actualy peak them. When you charge them you balance them so that you stop at the same voltage, but you will never know if a cell is actualy better then the one next to it.
If you are going to regulate the cells then this is how I would do it.
Make a minimum weight limit. I would go with like 8 lbs.
Then keep the dimensions the same.
Then the maximum number of cells that can be series is 4( maximum number of volts = 14.8)This will push the buggies over 50 m.p.h.
Basicly what I just did is allow people to run heavey bulky packs in qualifiers w/out worry of some one with lighter packs being able to smoke them in a quali where they don't need the capacity. The weight limit also allows manufacturers to use the same chasis that they use for 1/8th scale buggies so that you won't see 1/8th scale bj4s out on the track. The packs can be assembled in any shape you want to. It would be just like configuring a 6 cell stick in the shape of a cube or a hump pack.
Then another rule for anyone who doesn't know what they are doing.
Any pack that is run must be rated at 100+ amps of continuous current.
These cells will get ruined if there is too much amp draw on them. This will keep things nice and safe as long as people charge them properly. So basicly a 10k mah 10c pack or an 8k mah 13c pack is what it will take to run in the class.
Now, an even safer option are the a123 cells. However, a single company pretty much has a monopoly on these cells atm. If more companies enter the market with these cells they would make a better option then lipo. They are slightly heavier but they have all the advantages of lipo w/out the disadvantage. They can be charged in 20 minutes and they don't blow up. The cells come as 3.3 volt 2.1k mah cells. Currently the only way to get these cells for under $15 a cell is to purchase dewalt 32 volt battery packs off of ebay for $100 and take the 10 cells out of them and use those. You could make a 13.2 volt pack w/ like 8.4k mah for around $200.j
Just a note, lipos don't blow up either from charging and discharging under the conditions they will be used in. They may catch fire. The videos you see of them exploding are where they are connected directly to a car battery. A car battery will make a lot of things explode.
Here is a pic of some of the cars wwwdotrcpicsdotnet/view_single.php?medid=83379 take out the dot and replace with a period to view.
The Hyper 7 and the GS Storm are using a 32 pitch gears with the Novak HV.
I use the Mugen MBX5 Plettenberg Maximum and Quark 125B. Others use a low cost, but very effective BK wanderer $75 (Fiegao wtih German Bearings) and MM ($135). All other cars use the Kyosho spur MOD1 gear($5) and Century pinions($8). The rest is the kit to adapt to the chassis. The Feigao style motors need to be supported by a brace similar or just like the one on RC monster as well as a fan to be safe. The MM has worked well with external cooling also. On the mod1 we all stayed around a 12-13/46 spur that balanced out well for the temps and performance. The Plettenberg works well with the MM too. I have heard of problems that people have had with cogging with the 4 pole motors like the Plett but the Neu 1512-1.5D F that I',m using has not cogged yet with the MM. It seems some of the ones that have been cogging with the Neu and MM setup from the forums run tall pinions. With a higher rpm/v motor you could go lower pinion gears to help reduce cogging and keep the overall speed. It's is like trying to start off in your 5 speed pickup in 3rd gear.
There are many ways to setup your own vehicles and I'm very impressed with to name few Happywing, Mike from Monster, Jamie from starluckrc, glassdoctor, BrianG, serum, jixxer, jhautz, crazyjr, silentmonster, metalman, tiki_man36, jagboy, dabid_van, just to name a few off the top of my head.
It is also very motivating that Castle Creations with their Monster Mamba Max and Tekin with their new speed control, both American made will soon be out that are designed to handle the high powered electric vehicles.
If you would like some specifics about our different vehicles just PM.
i have no idea where to start on gearing a brushless conversion. what kind of gearing would one use in the EL8 using one of the Nue motors on a tight-ish outdoor track?
Gearing is based on the motor kv... and battery voltage.
I recomend @2000kv motor on 4s lipo. With this setup you would start around 14/46 for a tight track. You would only need to change if the top end is lacking or way too much for you to handle. A big track may need about 16/46 to get the top end to run with the hot nitros.
Speaking of gearing, I wonder if there would be any benefit to having a buggy fitted with a two-speed transmission. Since the buggy would already be in the 8 lb range, would the minuscule weight difference adversely affect performance?
Why would you want a 2speed? We are talking about cars that go 55 m.p.h. and hit 45 in under 3 seconds. They race on tracks that do not have a straight that is over 250 feet long. The reason this class will be good is because their is less maintanance, a two speed would add to that.
You obviously don't know very much about these lipo cells. If you will take a look around this forum consensus will show you that they are the way to go. A123 cells are another option, but they do weigh a considerable bit more, however they are much safer and can be charged faster. Here goes a run down on a lipo battery pack.
I know enough about them to have already bought 4 packs. When I mentioned waiting for the "lipo dust to settle", I was talking about how AE and Losi might be waiting to see what becomes the most popular pack/configuration before they design a 1/10 or 1/8 buggy specifically for lipo/BL.
BTW, "forum consensus" doesn't count for much in the real world. I still can't use my lipos at one of the two tracks I race at. As long as ROAR bans lipos, tracks that follow ROAR rules will ban lipos.
Understandably, a 2-speed tranny would add to the maintenance factor, and while maintenance-friendliness is the mainstay of electric, I don't think that the addition of that unit would still put it anywhere near the maintenance level of a nitro vehicle.
Top speed wasn't necessarily the reason I enquired about the 2-speed tranny, but rather how it would affect (or benefit) handling on tighter circuits. Wouldn't the lower, 1st gear also put less of a strain on the motor?
That is the way we have seen it. There is so much torque at low speed and enough on the high side that the 2 speed may not benefit much at all. Especially with the Brushless motors that have been discussed just in this thread.
By the time I hit full throttle on the transmitter on our staightaway, I'm hitting full brakes to slow back down.
You would have to see one run in person in a race to see what I'm talking about. It would put a smile on your face. These things basically pull like a freight train.
Quote:
Originally Posted by party_wagon
Why would you want a 2speed? We are talking about cars that go 55 m.p.h. and hit 45 in under 3 seconds. They race on tracks that do not have a straight that is over 250 feet long. The reason this class will be good is because their is less maintanance, a two speed would add to that.
I know enough about them to have already bought 4 packs. When I mentioned waiting for the "lipo dust to settle", I was talking about how AE and Losi might be waiting to see what becomes the most popular pack/configuration before they design a 1/10 or 1/8 buggy specifically for lipo/BL.
Bingo! He gets it. Too many different configurations of packs out there right now; chassis manufacturers won't commit until there's a semblance of fixed target. Back in the old days, the sub-C NiCd became the standard that was upheld for later Nimh and even some Lipo batteries (the Orion Lipo pack designed to fit existing Nimh cell slots comes immediately to mind.)
To that end, I could easily see Kyosho or Losi eventually produce dedicated chassis plates with recesses for the battery and motor; lowered and carefully positioned to optimize weight balance and CG. The diffs and everything else could simply then be unbolted from the nitro variant and attached to the electric chassis.
No one knew what a truggy at first was. Like 3 years ago people ran lowered t-maxxs. Now, they run full blown race bread truggies.
That's right. The important difference with the truggy/muggy is that it retains all the unaltered key components of its buggy sibling (powerplant, power source, clutch system, etc.) The chassis manufacturer could use those existing, established systems, and create a new vehicle around them. However, when certain key components of a given vehicle (in this case the battery unit) remain highly-variable, it creates some ambiguity unless the chassis manufacturer also decides to shoulder the burden of developing, manufacturing and distributing that component themselves. That translates to higher development costs on one set of shoulders, and thus, greater financial risk.
Look at virtually all the R/C chassis created in the last 20 years: they pretty much all use existing motors/engines/clutches/batteries, and simply design the vehicle around those components. When you take into consideration that the types of Lipo batteries being used in these modded 1/8 buggies weigh anywhere from 20-24 ounces, anyone can clearly see that this is the single heaviest component on the whole vehicle, and I don't feel out-of-place saying that its dimensions and (potentially improper) positioning can greatly affect the handling characteristics of that vehicle.
the reason for not having a 2 speed for electric motors:the brushless electric motor has a way different power band it will make the same hp and tork from 1000 all the way to 20000 lets say 2hp 2 ftpnds in most cases. a nitro builds to 2.5hp starting with almost nothing. So if you don't have a building power band why have gears unless your going for 100mph.
The dimensions of the cells realy don't matter. The only thing that realy should matter is that they can handle the amps and you have xmany cells in series. If you can endure a 30 minute main w/ 4k mah then go for it. Perhaps a minimum race rdy car weight would be nice as well. You can assemble your packs so that your chassis looks something like this.
cell{shaft}cell
motor mount{center diff}
motor{shaft}cell
The cells are saudered togather just like nicds and nimh cells. The only differance is that they can tolerate to be run for 30 minutes.
When I mentioned waiting for the "lipo dust to settle", I was talking about how AE and Losi might be waiting to see what becomes the most popular pack/configuration before they design a 1/10 or 1/8 buggy specifically for lipo/BL. 
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